Then again, did they ever say what exactly Big Whoop was, apart from "a portal to the very gates of Hell"? Maybe Big Whoop WAS a spell! LeChuck might have just used very EVIL ingredients.
Just thought it might make sense, though I'm not so sure about that...
Plus wasn't Big Whoop an amusement part to begin with? Coulda sworn that was on the sign in the LCR ending. The retcon was that Big Whoop was the gates of Hell.
Plus wasn't Big Whoop an amusement part to begin with? Coulda sworn that was on the sign in the LCR ending. The retcon was that Big Whoop was the gates of Hell.
Yeah. I kind of meant, but didn't really communicate, that I meant Big Whoop=Carnival of the Damned was a pretty dumb retcon. In that the whole scene just feels a lot more hokey, cartoonish, and ridiculous than the endings to the first two games, as silly as they still somewhat are.
Basically, I see CMI's ending as a cartoon played as a cartoon. Secret and Revenge feel more like a "serious adventure" with ridiculous elements, but played fairly straight. It's kind of a fine line, but CMI vaults over the line and puts on a clown wig and giant shoes. And then retcons the ending in a long speech for no good reason.
Basically, I see CMI's ending as a cartoon played as a cartoon. Secret and Revenge feel more like a "serious adventure" with ridiculous elements, but played fairly straight. It's kind of a fine line, but CMI vaults over the line and puts on a clown wig and giant shoes. And then retcons the ending in a long speech for no good reason.
Why did I hear this post in my head as Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw?
I thinked about this too. We know Lechuck was alive when finding Big Whoop *then something happened* and he is a Ghost Pirate.
I dont think finding BigWhoop should be the same to killing yourself. And according to this chapter he was dead, but we dont know how was he killed or what relation does that have with Big Whoop, if any.
Okay, Curse did not retcon Big Whoop into being an amusement park. What it did was play off the ending of MI2 and had LeChuck name the Carnival of the Damned after the Big Whoop treasure, which was the gates of hell. If you remember, the carnival at the end of MI2 was also named Big Whoop.
Really, if anything this undoes a retcon. Secret says that LeChuck died trying to find the Secret of Monkey Island in order to impress Elaine. Curse alters this to say that he was looking for Big Whoop, overtook Marley, and passed through it, and that's how he died. Well, if his death wasn't caused by Big Whoop and he ended up in the Crossroads, then his shred of life may have been related to his failure to win Elaine.
Or consider this. Perhaps LeChuck was trying to track down the Secret for Elaine, failed, and died. He went through something similar to Guybrush and managed to rip open the Crossroads and return to the land of the living and retake his body. Being a fragile zombie wasn't working out for him so well and he didn't have love to restore his body, so Big Whoop was the next best thing. He cleaned up the best he could (lots of deodorant), won over Minnie Goodsoup, sold the diamond to buy a boat, and overtook Marley's crew to reach Big Whoop and become a voodoo enhanced ghost, which may explain why LeChuck and Morgan can interact with the physical world but Guybrush couldn't. Perhaps passing through Big Whoop acts as a portal to hell for the spirit but kills the body, so LeChuck had his body taken to his fortress by his still-living henchman, Largo LaGrande, in case he should ever need it.
A bit far fetched, but I was more trying to illustrate that it's possible that the Crossroads and hell are two different places and LeChuck has visited both. Also, I apparently have a talent for drawing up crackpot theories out of nowhere.
You have not been paying attention to the forums. Tales is not Monkey Island 5. It is Monkey Island 6. That was even its codename during development.
For the 90 millionth time, that was more of a joke about the passage of time to distance the game from EMI than them actually intending it to be called MI6.
Which doesn't change the fact that there's still an undefined Guybrush Threepwood adventure between EMI and Tales, in which LeChuck returns to life as a killer walrus, regains his zombie form somehow, and collects the Thirteen Monkeys of Montevideo in a fiendish plan to open a portal to the Crossroads and gain ultimate voodoo power, forcing Guybrush to assemble the Cursed Cutlass of Kuflu, steal yet another ship, recruit yet another mutinous crew, and sail to the Rock of Gelato to stop him.
The scary thing is that most of that is actually canon.
Which doesn't change the fact that there's still an undefined Guybrush Threepwood adventure between EMI and Tales, in which LeChuck returns to life as a killer walrus, regains his zombie form somehow, and collects the Thirteen Monkeys of Montevideo in a fiendish plan to open a portal to the Crossroads and gain ultimate voodoo power, forcing Guybrush to assemble the Cursed Cutlass of Kuflu, steal yet another ship, recruit yet another mutinous crew, and sail to the Rock of Gelato to stop him.
The scary thing is that most of that is actually canon.
I would really like to see what happened 'in between'.
You know what I just thought of? It'd be awesome to play the 'in between', but playing as Lechuck!
LeChuck goes to Hell via Big Whoop, makes a deal with the Devil or something, swims back to the Crossroads, steals a Shred of Life and comes back as a Ghost.
Okay, Curse did not retcon Big Whoop into being an amusement park. What it did was play off the ending of MI2 and had LeChuck name the Carnival of the Damned after the Big Whoop treasure, which was the gates of hell. If you remember, the carnival at the end of MI2 was also named Big Whoop.
Out of all the possible intentions the original developers could have had regarding what happens at the end of MI2, I'm sure LeChuck actually building a theme park on Monkey Island was not one of them.
Which doesn't change the fact that there's still an undefined Guybrush Threepwood adventure between EMI and Tales, in which LeChuck returns to life as a killer walrus, regains his zombie form somehow, and collects the Thirteen Monkeys of Montevideo in a fiendish plan to open a portal to the Crossroads and gain ultimate voodoo power, forcing Guybrush to assemble the Cursed Cutlass of Kuflu, steal yet another ship, recruit yet another mutinous crew, and sail to the Rock of Gelato to stop him.
The scary thing is that most of that is actually canon.
We called it Monkey Island 6 for a while as a joke, but saying "there was a fifth game in between" doesn't mean you should actually see that game, or that it actually exists. The whole point was to say "time has passed between Escape from Monkey Island and Tales of Monkey Island -- the characters have gone on some more adventures, grown a little, learned some things, and probably healed some continuity wounds in the process." The point wasn't "there will be another game between Escape and Tales" -- that would be silly! You'd spend the whole game assembling a cursed cutlass, chasing LeChuck down to make him stop harvesting monkeys, and then right before you could go to take out LeChuck and save Elaine, the game would end and say "To be continued in Tales of Monkey Island!" Actually, that would be pretty amazing, but it would definitely be unfulfilling, I think!
The fact that stuff has happened between EMI and TMI does not make TMI become MI6.
If that were the case, MI2 is MI3, CMI is MI5, EMI is MI7, and TMI is MI9, because there are things of varying length that you don't see between each game, but that's completely illogical in every way.
Comments
Then again, did they ever say what exactly Big Whoop was, apart from "a portal to the very gates of Hell"? Maybe Big Whoop WAS a spell! LeChuck might have just used very EVIL ingredients.
Just thought it might make sense, though I'm not so sure about that...
I never really liked the amusement park idea though. This Tim Burton feeling is kinda more atmospheric.
Yeah as I recall LeChuck called Big Whoop a portal to Hell. He never said what "hell" was. Perhaps he just hates amusement parks.
I was kinda hoping the dog would find another E ticket in chapter 5
but... but... :eek:
Basically, I see CMI's ending as a cartoon played as a cartoon. Secret and Revenge feel more like a "serious adventure" with ridiculous elements, but played fairly straight. It's kind of a fine line, but CMI vaults over the line and puts on a clown wig and giant shoes. And then retcons the ending in a long speech for no good reason.
Why did I hear this post in my head as Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw?
I fixed it for you
I dont think finding BigWhoop should be the same to killing yourself. And according to this chapter he was dead, but we dont know how was he killed or what relation does that have with Big Whoop, if any.
Really, if anything this undoes a retcon. Secret says that LeChuck died trying to find the Secret of Monkey Island in order to impress Elaine. Curse alters this to say that he was looking for Big Whoop, overtook Marley, and passed through it, and that's how he died. Well, if his death wasn't caused by Big Whoop and he ended up in the Crossroads, then his shred of life may have been related to his failure to win Elaine.
Or consider this. Perhaps LeChuck was trying to track down the Secret for Elaine, failed, and died. He went through something similar to Guybrush and managed to rip open the Crossroads and return to the land of the living and retake his body. Being a fragile zombie wasn't working out for him so well and he didn't have love to restore his body, so Big Whoop was the next best thing. He cleaned up the best he could (lots of deodorant), won over Minnie Goodsoup, sold the diamond to buy a boat, and overtook Marley's crew to reach Big Whoop and become a voodoo enhanced ghost, which may explain why LeChuck and Morgan can interact with the physical world but Guybrush couldn't. Perhaps passing through Big Whoop acts as a portal to hell for the spirit but kills the body, so LeChuck had his body taken to his fortress by his still-living henchman, Largo LaGrande, in case he should ever need it.
A bit far fetched, but I was more trying to illustrate that it's possible that the Crossroads and hell are two different places and LeChuck has visited both. Also, I apparently have a talent for drawing up crackpot theories out of nowhere.
All of this was clearly, concisely and entertainingly explained in Monkey Island 5.
That should be the official explanation for all Monkey Island continuity problems ever.
A wizard did it.
You have not been paying attention to the forums. Tales is not Monkey Island 5. It is Monkey Island 6. That was even its codename during development.
For the 90 millionth time, that was more of a joke about the passage of time to distance the game from EMI than them actually intending it to be called MI6.
TALES OF MONKEY ISLAND IS MI5. END OF STORY.
The scary thing is that most of that is actually canon.
Monkey Island 4.5. Can't dispute that, eh, Paley?
You know what I just thought of? It'd be awesome to play the 'in between', but playing as Lechuck!
:winslow:
Out of all the possible intentions the original developers could have had regarding what happens at the end of MI2, I'm sure LeChuck actually building a theme park on Monkey Island was not one of them.
The fact that stuff has happened between EMI and TMI does not make TMI become MI6.
If that were the case, MI2 is MI3, CMI is MI5, EMI is MI7, and TMI is MI9, because there are things of varying length that you don't see between each game, but that's completely illogical in every way.