To be fair, we didn't really see any evidence that Clem liked Kenny at all in Season One, and yet people play Season Two assuming they shared some powerful bond.
To be fair, we didn't really see any evidence that Clem liked Kenny at all in Season One, and yet people play Season Two assuming they shared some powerful bond.
But the argument about things like 'she didn't do it with christa because she says only with lee in season 2' could just as easily be to do with the writiers forgetting they spent such a long time together, as there is evidence for.
We would give Christa credit if we knew how exactly hard it was.
Did Christa go through a horde of zombies with Clementine ? Nope, when t… morehey do this in s2 Clementine only mentions having doing it with Lee back then.
I even doubt they encountered that many zombies since Clementine learned so many new things regarding close-combat fight with walkers from Jane. She was not that much more experienced at beginning of s2 than what she was at the end of s1.
When with Christa they probably kept low profile and avoided any confrontation or risky situations to get stuff, hence their starving and desperate situation at the campfire.
Not that I blame Christa. Making your way through places where you risk encountering zombies is something you do when with a larger group, with weapons, of if you're on your own and know hot to sneak in like Jane. Not with a child.
Christa probably was very concerned with Clementine's safety (and her own baby'… [view original content]
By spoiled I mean, of course, she looked after Clementine too much and seem like she didn't show her new survival skills other than basic in… morestincts of surviving and gathering food/drink. Clementine didn't want to keep that fire lit and kinda wanted Christa to handle it and handle her.
It's only until she is alone that she realizes she needs to kick it into high gear and really learn how to survive.
We should appreciate Christa more. During the time they were together she taught Clem how to:
* sew up her arm
* use melee weapons
* … moreturn off a malfunctioning wind turbine
* kick down a door
* keep her hat glued on in a raging river
* magically obtain baby formula
* and defuse a nuclear bomb
But she didn't teach her how to make and sustain a fire, so points off for that.
We actually got to see Lee protect Clementine with his own life all thoroughout season 1, but in Christa's case it was a cheap time lapse to grow Clem quickly to prepare her for the whole season 2 thingy. You can't compare Christa with with Lee plz.
So you want me to disregard what actually happens and is said in the game to make my conclusions, just because "the writers should have made it different" or "the writers should have thought about it" ?
If we go that way, perhaps Christa had frequent fits of anger during which she beated Clementine screaming "Omid is dead because of you !" but Clem never mentions it because the writers forgot.
Joking aside... From what I deduce from all evidence available to me in Clementine's behaviour at the beginning of s2, acquired skills since s1's ending, and (rare) words about her time with Christa, nothing leads me to think Clementine should think higher of Christa than of Lee. And as a matter of fact, she doesn't, and that's all the evidence I need.
Once again, I don't despise Christa nor want to diminish the fact Clem could survive for 16 months in her company, but I disagree with people saying Christa was the new Lee or Lee 2.0 or whatever.
But the argument about things like 'she didn't do it with christa because she says only with lee in season 2' could just as easily be to do with the writiers forgetting they spent such a long time together, as there is evidence for.
I give Christa all the credit in the world, especially if she harbored some anger or resentment at Clementine for what happened to Omid. She made a promise to take care of Clementine and she did it. Thats why I hate so much that she just vanished from the story.
Christa actually kinda spoiled Clem during most of that time when you inspect her dialogue in S2E1 with the fire. Lee taught her basically everything she needed to know to survive.
You know what, I feel jealous. Because of that timeskip bullshoot. Lee and Clem spend hardly 4 months together where as Clem and Christa spe… morend 2 years together (8 months with Omid and Christa, 16 months with only Christa) That event as a player proves that all I've done for Clem as Lee is pointless. Don't deny it. It is pointless now. I asked Gavin Hammon the same question and he said;
''Quailty > Quantity, in my opinion.''
But I don't know. Thanks Telltale for making a character we barely knew for 2 days spending more time with Clem than anyone EVEN more than the main character himself. Like; why didn't they let us to play as Christa in S1 if she's gonna spend so much time with Clem?
To be fair, we didn't really see any evidence that Clem liked Kenny at all in Season One, and yet people play Season Two assuming they shared some powerful bond.
i don't think christa was so cold to clementine all the time, i think she was kind most of the time, i just think she was in a bad mood due to lack of food, miserable weather and being tired, that can make anybody cranky, i bet (if she is still alive) she regrets that the last time she saw clementine she was in such a bad mood
To be fair, she could've just taught Clementine how to sew fabric, and Clem used that knowledge to sew her own flesh. Scary concept, but "Just like Christa showed me" and "Just like I learned in sewing school" sound pretty similar when you think about it.
Let me get this straight..
She taught Clem how to STITCH FLESH in case of a wound, as said in episode 1, and you think she didn't teach h… moreer any survival skills?
Yeah whatever.
And the skills of gathering for food and drink are extremely important.
Dont get me wrong, christa kept clem alive...but she also was extremely mad at clem and blamed omids death on her. She actually wouldn't talk to clem until the first ep of season two if you remember.
Uh....no I don't remember because that didn't happen?
Clem saying 'christa, talk to me' doesnt mean she was silent for SIXTEEN months!
She probably became more withdrawn. But even if subconsciously she did blame clem for the death, she never said 'this is your fault' like Kenny did. She never tried to make her feel bad for it. Which is what Lee would've wanted, and an avenue in which Kenny failed.
Dont get me wrong, christa kept clem alive...but she also was extremely mad at clem and blamed omids death on her. She actually wouldn't talk to clem until the first ep of season two if you remember.
I'm pretty sure she subconsciously blamed Clem for Omid's death, but tried to convince Clementine and herself that it's not. Still, I never felt the two of them had a close bond, neither during the opening prologue of season two, or the scene which takes place sixteen months later.
Uh....no I don't remember because that didn't happen?
Clem saying 'christa, talk to me' doesnt mean she was silent for SIXTEEN months!
… more She probably became more withdrawn. But even if subconsciously she did blame clem for the death, she never said 'this is your fault' like Kenny did. She never tried to make her feel bad for it. Which is what Lee would've wanted, and an avenue in which Kenny failed.
Yeah, it rustles my jimmies. Christa is one of my faves. She kept her promise to Lee of keeping Clem safe 'til the end.
She doesn't hate Clem, she's just tired, hopeless and miserable. Who wouldn't be, in her position?She lived in the woods for 16 months...alone with Clem...16 months!! With the constant threat of zombies or scavengers, all while taking care of a kid,constantly on the move, can you imagine the stress? Not to mention the pain of losing her boyfriend and baby.
If she didn't care for Clem, she wouldn't have sacrificed herself to protect her from Winston and friends. Even after all the crap she's been through, she still puts Clem's life before her own.
People who say she doesn't deserve the title of Clem's guardian just as much as Lee can butt off!
Don't you think trying to convince clem that it wasn't her fault was actually an extremely nice thing to do and shows that she understand how clem works?
Clem has a problem with thinking shes caused deaths, and Christa specifically tried to save her from that. Thats a pretty awesome caretaker if you ask me.
I'm pretty sure she subconsciously blamed Clem for Omid's death, but tried to convince Clementine and herself that it's not. Still, I never … morefelt the two of them had a close bond, neither during the opening prologue of season two, or the scene which takes place sixteen months later.
Yeah sure, I agree with you. Just that her subconsciousness always blamed Clem and that caused them to drift apart a bit.
Christa is an awesome person, and a great caretaker. But nontheless, I think Omid's death is to blame that the two of them never bonded really close.
Plus, it really is her fault. She should have taken that pistol with her.
Don't you think trying to convince clem that it wasn't her fault was actually an extremely nice thing to do and shows that she understand ho… morew clem works?
Clem has a problem with thinking shes caused deaths, and Christa specifically tried to save her from that. Thats a pretty awesome caretaker if you ask me.
Yeah sure, I agree with you. Just that her subconsciousness always blamed Clem and that caused them to drift apart a bit.
Christa is an aw… moreesome person, and a great caretaker. But nontheless, I think Omid's death is to blame that the two of them never bonded really close.
Plus, it really is her fault. She should have taken that pistol with her.
'Just like Christa showed me' strongly implies that Christa taught her specifically how to do this. Otherwise she would have said 'Just like sewing' or whatever.
Also, it makes sense that Christa taught her how to stitch, as stitches are very often needed after giving birth, and Christa would have needed Clem to do that for her?
To be fair, she could've just taught Clementine how to sew fabric, and Clem used that knowledge to sew her own flesh. Scary concept, but "Ju… morest like Christa showed me" and "Just like I learned in sewing school" sound pretty similar when you think about it.
I actually believe that Christa's baby was stillborn and in the middle of the night, she had it. I bet Clem noticed that Christa's stomach was getting smaller and finally mustered up the strength to ask her about the baby. Christa probably told Clem it was none of her business. As Clem tried to be persistent in her asking, Christa probably snapped back that it none of Clem's business. They continued to walk through the woods in complete silence and the baby was never asked about again. This would explain Clem's hesitation/fascination to putting her head against Rebecca's stomach and her unfamiliarity with the labor process. It would also highlighted Clem and Christa's relationship. Even though their personal connection was strained, Christa cared of Clem enough to dispose of her stillborn child while Clem slept so that she would never have to see or deal with a birth of a stillborn.
I blame the writer of Amid The Ruins for forgetting Christa's existence. The token mention of Lee in the museum seems to conveniently ignor… moree the fact that Omid was a Civil War fanatic, and the only way I can try to justify Clem not knowing anything about helping Rebecca give birth is that she's repressed the memory/Christa left her alone and had the stillborn baby by herself.
I hope they remedy that in EP5. There's no reason for Clem to not mention Christa and her baby at all, when a massive part of Christa's character was about her pregnancy.
I blame the writer of Amid The Ruins for forgetting Christa's existence. The token mention of Lee in the museum seems to conveniently ignor… moree the fact that Omid was a Civil War fanatic, and the only way I can try to justify Clem not knowing anything about helping Rebecca give birth is that she's repressed the memory/Christa left her alone and had the stillborn baby by herself.
Bingo! Clem reminded Kenny of Duck, so he bonded with her ASAP. Sarita and Clem gave Kenny a feeling that her had his old family back.
Here is a little theory. Check this out! Sarita = New Katjaa and Clem = New Duck (from Kenny's perspective). Remember in Season 1, Katjaa died FIRST before Duck was shot. Sarita dies in "Amid The Ruins." What if some of the reason why Kenny was hurt was he thought that Clem would be next? Yes, he is mad because his love of his life was taken from him again. But since Clem is New Duck, he was upset because now he thinks Clem will be next and he will be alone again. Just something I thought up of just now as I read the comments above.
Bingo! Clem reminded Kenny of Duck, so he bonded with her ASAP. Sarita and Clem gave Kenny a feeling that her had his old family back.
… moreHere is a little theory. Check this out! Sarita = New Katjaa and Clem = New Duck (from Kenny's perspective). Remember in Season 1, Katjaa died FIRST before Duck was shot. Sarita dies in "Amid The Ruins." What if some of the reason why Kenny was hurt was he thought that Clem would be next? Yes, he is mad because his love of his life was taken from him again. But since Clem is New Duck, he was upset because now he thinks Clem will be next and he will be alone again. Just something I thought up of just now as I read the comments above.
We actually got to see Lee protect Clementine with his own life all thoroughout season 1, but in Christa's case it was a cheap time lapse to grow Clem quickly to prepare her for the whole season 2 thingy. You can't compare Christa with with Lee plz.
I think the reason why Clem mentions Lee more than Christa is because she has had more pleasant memories with Lee than Christa. Even if you mention the time when Omid was alive, it was all marred by his death. Not only was Omid shot, but it was in the chest. We still don't know if Christa shot him in the head before or after he turned. If it was after, then those memories from before his death are completely destroyed by the memory of a walker Omid. [Side note: yes, I know Clem shot/left a dying Lee, but Lee gave her advice in his dying moments and Clem still mentions those final words] Christa was undoubtedly with Clementine more than anyone, only second to Clem's parents. She looked out for her. Christa did, beyond a shadow of a doubt, care for Clem. But was there a relationship or any kind of bond? You can care for someone without bonding with them (some nurses and caregivers are a real life example), but the bond is what makes it a lasting memory. I personally believe that had Clem developed a personal relationship with Christa, she wouldn't have cherished Lee's pic or her drawing as much as she seemed to have had at the campfire (not saying she would get rid of them, she would still have them). I bet that if Clem and Christa had found a good group to meet up with and rest, even if they would be leaving shortly after, it would have given them time to actually talk, forgive one another, and develop that bond that was needed between the two.
TL;DR - Christa deserves more recognition as Clem's longest caregiver, second to Clem's parents. The reason Clem mentions Lee more is because of the positive memories and personal relationship that they built and shared.
If you make Clem say that she misses Lee, Christa looks sympathetic. If you say you miss Omid, however, she turns furious. It seems to me that she still bears a lot of resentment towards Clem (as well as herself) for the circumstances behind his death.
I don't think she was ever as aggressive in her grieving method as Kenny.
If you make Clem say that she misses Lee, Christa looks sympathetic. If you say you miss Omid, however, she turns furious. It seems to me … morethat she still bears a lot of resentment towards Clem (as well as herself) for the circumstances behind his death.
I don't think she was ever as aggressive in her grieving method as Kenny.
Although, what Christa did might actually be worse for Clem. Kenny angrily berating her was bad, no doubt about that. But then it was over. There was resolution. Christa, on the other hand, may have never said a single word to Clem about the matter. But repressing her pain and never speaking about it would have only caused Clem's feelings of guilt to fester and grow.
Kenny is the dad who yells at you for hours until you cry and then takes you out for ice cream the next day. Christa is the mom who never raises her voice once, but seems like she's silently disappointed in you forever.
We don't know she never said a single word to clem about the matter.
I still think remaining silent is better than actively blaming someone and saying they cause lots of deaths.
And for the vast vast majority of people, Kenny never apologises. He barely speak to you on your own for the rest of the episode, and never gives a thought to how she is feeling. So, the analogy of kenny 'taking you out for ice cream the next day' is flawed.
It's the difference between a dad yelling and swearing at you and then never addressing the issue again, or a dad bottling up their emotions to stop their child from feeling responsible.
Although, what Christa did might actually be worse for Clem. Kenny angrily berating her was bad, no doubt about that. But then it was over. … moreThere was resolution. Christa, on the other hand, may have never said a single word to Clem about the matter. But repressing her pain and never speaking about it would have only caused Clem's feelings of guilt to fester and grow.
Kenny is the dad who yells at you for hours until you cry and then takes you out for ice cream the next day. Christa is the mom who never raises her voice once, but seems like she's silently disappointed in you forever.
Comments
To be fair, we didn't really see any evidence that Clem liked Kenny at all in Season One, and yet people play Season Two assuming they shared some powerful bond.
Well mine still doesn't
Neither does mine :P
Mike >>> Kenny and Luke combined
But the argument about things like 'she didn't do it with christa because she says only with lee in season 2' could just as easily be to do with the writiers forgetting they spent such a long time together, as there is evidence for.
Let me get this straight..
She taught Clem how to STITCH FLESH in case of a wound, as said in episode 1, and you think she didn't teach her any survival skills?
Yeah whatever.
And the skills of gathering for food and drink are extremely important.
Nuclear bomb? Dudeeeeeee no spoilers for episode 5 here!
We actually got to see Lee protect Clementine with his own life all thoroughout season 1, but in Christa's case it was a cheap time lapse to grow Clem quickly to prepare her for the whole season 2 thingy. You can't compare Christa with with Lee plz.
So you want me to disregard what actually happens and is said in the game to make my conclusions, just because "the writers should have made it different" or "the writers should have thought about it" ?
If we go that way, perhaps Christa had frequent fits of anger during which she beated Clementine screaming "Omid is dead because of you !" but Clem never mentions it because the writers forgot.
Joking aside... From what I deduce from all evidence available to me in Clementine's behaviour at the beginning of s2, acquired skills since s1's ending, and (rare) words about her time with Christa, nothing leads me to think Clementine should think higher of Christa than of Lee. And as a matter of fact, she doesn't, and that's all the evidence I need.
Once again, I don't despise Christa nor want to diminish the fact Clem could survive for 16 months in her company, but I disagree with people saying Christa was the new Lee or Lee 2.0 or whatever.
I give Christa all the credit in the world, especially if she harbored some anger or resentment at Clementine for what happened to Omid. She made a promise to take care of Clementine and she did it. Thats why I hate so much that she just vanished from the story.
Lee didnt teach her how to make a fire.
Lee gave Clementine a foundation. Just because they werent together as long doesnt make his time with her pointless.
I know, they barely talked and the few times they did, he was sniping at her because of Duck.
i don't think christa was so cold to clementine all the time, i think she was kind most of the time, i just think she was in a bad mood due to lack of food, miserable weather and being tired, that can make anybody cranky, i bet (if she is still alive) she regrets that the last time she saw clementine she was in such a bad mood
MyChrista
To be fair, she could've just taught Clementine how to sew fabric, and Clem used that knowledge to sew her own flesh. Scary concept, but "Just like Christa showed me" and "Just like I learned in sewing school" sound pretty similar when you think about it.
jumps back into the bunker
Dont get me wrong, christa kept clem alive...but she also was extremely mad at clem and blamed omids death on her. She actually wouldn't talk to clem until the first ep of season two if you remember.
Hahaha I remember that, that was from ages ago
Uh....no I don't remember because that didn't happen?
Clem saying 'christa, talk to me' doesnt mean she was silent for SIXTEEN months!
She probably became more withdrawn. But even if subconsciously she did blame clem for the death, she never said 'this is your fault' like Kenny did. She never tried to make her feel bad for it. Which is what Lee would've wanted, and an avenue in which Kenny failed.
I'm pretty sure she subconsciously blamed Clem for Omid's death, but tried to convince Clementine and herself that it's not. Still, I never felt the two of them had a close bond, neither during the opening prologue of season two, or the scene which takes place sixteen months later.
Yeah, it rustles my jimmies. Christa is one of my faves. She kept her promise to Lee of keeping Clem safe 'til the end.
She doesn't hate Clem, she's just tired, hopeless and miserable. Who wouldn't be, in her position?She lived in the woods for 16 months...alone with Clem...16 months!! With the constant threat of zombies or scavengers, all while taking care of a kid,constantly on the move, can you imagine the stress? Not to mention the pain of losing her boyfriend and baby.
If she didn't care for Clem, she wouldn't have sacrificed herself to protect her from Winston and friends. Even after all the crap she's been through, she still puts Clem's life before her own.
People who say she doesn't deserve the title of Clem's guardian just as much as Lee can butt off!
Don't you think trying to convince clem that it wasn't her fault was actually an extremely nice thing to do and shows that she understand how clem works?
Clem has a problem with thinking shes caused deaths, and Christa specifically tried to save her from that. Thats a pretty awesome caretaker if you ask me.
Yeah sure, I agree with you. Just that her subconsciousness always blamed Clem and that caused them to drift apart a bit.
Christa is an awesome person, and a great caretaker. But nontheless, I think Omid's death is to blame that the two of them never bonded really close.
Plus, it really is her fault. She should have taken that pistol with her.
Yeah, that might be true on the face of things, but I reckon deep down they care for each other a hell of a lot.
Sure they do. I agree with you 100%. I just say that I think Clem and Lee had a much deeper bond than Clem and Christa.
Wow, that's kind of weird. As bad as this may sound, we could've been even as attatched to Christa as much as we were to Lee. Maybe even more!
Uh....
'Just like Christa showed me' strongly implies that Christa taught her specifically how to do this. Otherwise she would have said 'Just like sewing' or whatever.
Also, it makes sense that Christa taught her how to stitch, as stitches are very often needed after giving birth, and Christa would have needed Clem to do that for her?
I actually believe that Christa's baby was stillborn and in the middle of the night, she had it. I bet Clem noticed that Christa's stomach was getting smaller and finally mustered up the strength to ask her about the baby. Christa probably told Clem it was none of her business. As Clem tried to be persistent in her asking, Christa probably snapped back that it none of Clem's business. They continued to walk through the woods in complete silence and the baby was never asked about again. This would explain Clem's hesitation/fascination to putting her head against Rebecca's stomach and her unfamiliarity with the labor process. It would also highlighted Clem and Christa's relationship. Even though their personal connection was strained, Christa cared of Clem enough to dispose of her stillborn child while Clem slept so that she would never have to see or deal with a birth of a stillborn.
I hope they remedy that in EP5. There's no reason for Clem to not mention Christa and her baby at all, when a massive part of Christa's character was about her pregnancy.
Bingo! Clem reminded Kenny of Duck, so he bonded with her ASAP. Sarita and Clem gave Kenny a feeling that her had his old family back.
Here is a little theory. Check this out! Sarita = New Katjaa and Clem = New Duck (from Kenny's perspective). Remember in Season 1, Katjaa died FIRST before Duck was shot. Sarita dies in "Amid The Ruins." What if some of the reason why Kenny was hurt was he thought that Clem would be next? Yes, he is mad because his love of his life was taken from him again. But since Clem is New Duck, he was upset because now he thinks Clem will be next and he will be alone again. Just something I thought up of just now as I read the comments above.
Agreed
I disagree that Clem is new Duck.
I think she WAS new duck. But the baby has replaced her in Kenny's heart.
Christa protected Clem with her life in episode 1, so we are to assume they had that level of care for one another.
I think the reason why Clem mentions Lee more than Christa is because she has had more pleasant memories with Lee than Christa. Even if you mention the time when Omid was alive, it was all marred by his death. Not only was Omid shot, but it was in the chest. We still don't know if Christa shot him in the head before or after he turned. If it was after, then those memories from before his death are completely destroyed by the memory of a walker Omid. [Side note: yes, I know Clem shot/left a dying Lee, but Lee gave her advice in his dying moments and Clem still mentions those final words] Christa was undoubtedly with Clementine more than anyone, only second to Clem's parents. She looked out for her. Christa did, beyond a shadow of a doubt, care for Clem. But was there a relationship or any kind of bond? You can care for someone without bonding with them (some nurses and caregivers are a real life example), but the bond is what makes it a lasting memory. I personally believe that had Clem developed a personal relationship with Christa, she wouldn't have cherished Lee's pic or her drawing as much as she seemed to have had at the campfire (not saying she would get rid of them, she would still have them). I bet that if Clem and Christa had found a good group to meet up with and rest, even if they would be leaving shortly after, it would have given them time to actually talk, forgive one another, and develop that bond that was needed between the two.
TL;DR - Christa deserves more recognition as Clem's longest caregiver, second to Clem's parents. The reason Clem mentions Lee more is because of the positive memories and personal relationship that they built and shared.
Bitter old Christa that blamed poor Clem for getting Omeed killed?
If you make Clem say that she misses Lee, Christa looks sympathetic. If you say you miss Omid, however, she turns furious. It seems to me that she still bears a lot of resentment towards Clem (as well as herself) for the circumstances behind his death.
I don't think she was ever as aggressive in her grieving method as Kenny.
Well that's because Christa, unlike Kenny, understands clem as a person and knows that if she yelled at her clem would feel horrible.
Although, what Christa did might actually be worse for Clem. Kenny angrily berating her was bad, no doubt about that. But then it was over. There was resolution. Christa, on the other hand, may have never said a single word to Clem about the matter. But repressing her pain and never speaking about it would have only caused Clem's feelings of guilt to fester and grow.
Kenny is the dad who yells at you for hours until you cry and then takes you out for ice cream the next day. Christa is the mom who never raises her voice once, but seems like she's silently disappointed in you forever.
We don't know she never said a single word to clem about the matter.
I still think remaining silent is better than actively blaming someone and saying they cause lots of deaths.
And for the vast vast majority of people, Kenny never apologises. He barely speak to you on your own for the rest of the episode, and never gives a thought to how she is feeling. So, the analogy of kenny 'taking you out for ice cream the next day' is flawed.
It's the difference between a dad yelling and swearing at you and then never addressing the issue again, or a dad bottling up their emotions to stop their child from feeling responsible.