To bad Kenny's not the fucking boss of Clem, and doesn't get to make her decisions. No matter how delusional he is or how much he tries to control and manipulate her.
That didn't happen almost instantly after. It was before, when the situation had not escalated into a fight yet and Jane hadn't slit open his stomach for instance.
Of course defender of others is a real thing. You'd be awfully stupid to not think so, but that wasn't what I was saying. I'll just leave it at this anyway.
If you ask people who shot Kenny (their very first play through), who then found out what Jane did, and who then rewound to be with Kenny, I… more think they'll say they never "murdered" Kenny.
And now some definitions. "Murder" is a type of "killing," but not all "killings" are "murder." Murder is an unlawful killing of a human being with malice afterthought. E.g. you could kill Lee by shooting him, but that wasn't "murder" since there was no malice there. You could put Duck out of his misery but that's not "murder" since there was no malice there. Shooting Kenny was not "murder" (unless the player absolutely positively wanted Kenny dead, and malice was their intent when shooting him.) In addition, Defense of others is a real thing, fyi.
Just saying he wouldn't leave her. I'm not pro-kenny or pro-jane I was just pointing out that regardless of what clem wanted Kenny wouldn't leave her with someone he suspected of letting a kid die.
To bad Kenny's not the fucking boss of Clem, and doesn't get to make her decisions. No matter how delusional he is or how much he tries to control and manipulate her.
Honestly I'd think that Jane may have just ran away and stopped somewhere nearby and gone back to put Clementine out of her misery and attempt to save Luke and Sarah but since the scenario required 2 people pushing and 1 holding the door, I think none of them would've lived if Clementine actually died at this point.
Who said Jane was letting Clem suffer? She could've been moving so fast to put Clem out of her misery. It's just a big assumption she's runn… moreing away and leaving Clem for dead. You don't know where Jane goes, and you have no idea of knowing where she goes, because the scene only lasts like 3 seconds.
True, But not true. It was still Luke who made the choice. If you were doing something important, and A friend of yours said, "Let's go vandalize shit." and you said yes, That's not your friends fault, That's on you.
If you carry your sister ( who I mind you Jamie didn't want to go on anymore) then that means you're like Lee in my book yea Lee didn't leave clem but Jane came back to Clem if you played the game she comes back, she is teaching you how to live and that you have to do things on your own you also teach her in the prosses, Jane is what you call a lone wolf but give them the reasons to sat and they will
If you ask Jane to help sarah she goes and TRIES then a PEICE of wood drops on her head and the zombies get to close
so what Luke fucking agreed that's on Luke HE KNEW HE SHOULD HAVE PATROLLED that's on Luke not Jane Luke is a big boy he COULD HAVE REFUSED! luke put them in danger Jane just asked that's all
Jane is 100% Lee in my opinion and how I played the game
Jane is no Lee. Jane never cared for her own sister, she left her to die while Lee tried his best to find his family and put his brother out… more of his misery. Lee never abandoned Clem and Jane left Clem twice. If you let Nick's walker kill you, you'll see that Jane just leaves and let you get eaten. Jane even teached you to leave your own friends behind, for example Sarah, she didn't even try to help, she never wanted to learn from her mistakes. Jane even never cared for baby as she made an offer with Luke that indirectly caused Sarah to die. Jane is 100% no Lee.
I always found the dynamic with Jane and Luke's little ahem 'rendezvous' extremely beneficial to their character development. It simultaneously dismantled the 'perfect Luke' that we were being force-fed in addition to leading us to rethink our notion of Jane as some kind of people repelling stone. As for blame... I was more mad at Luke, to be honest. Probably just because I expected more from him. When Jane said she was leaving, I felt relief because of the entire situation that occurred between the two.
Copy/paste.
Ok really, I love both Jane and Luke but I can't understand how people keep thinking this is without a doubt Jane's fault. Fi… morerst off, we don't know exactly what Luke and Jane said to each other as it was never explicitly stated what they said to each other in that observation deck. In addition, Luke clearly knew what his job was. In the scene before everyone split up to do their jobs, Jane walked away immediately, saying, "I'll check the building by the river" and is not seen again the rest of that scene. And Jane left before Luke ever announced his duty to check the perimeter for walkers (a duty which he assigned to himself!) to everyone, minus possibly Jane. The rest of the group had guns; when Jane and Luke were together, Jane could've assumed some of the rest of the group was on duty if Luke never mentioned what his specific job was to Jane. If it was anyone's fault that the group was caught off guard by walkers that we can… [view original content]
It doesn't seem fair to say that there was no build-up. Though they had little onscreen time together, Luke did express his intrigue towards Jane earlier in the episode. Besides, I figured that the event was also intended to be seemingly out of nowhere in order to startle us and conflict our feelings on Jane leaving a bit more.
Human comfort is nice and all, but there is a time and a place. The two just so happened to make the wrong call in both timing and places, w… morehen they could have just got 'busy' at another time instead.
Nevertheless, I didn't really care much for the scene between the two. It just came out of nowhere, had no believable build up or foreshadowing to the event, and was used to fuel the highly unbalanced Kenny vs Luke conflict later on.
A bit different if it results in death, don't ya think?
Tbh, they were both not thinking very clearly at all. Both were very unstable. Th… moree choice unfortunately came down to which type you prefer. Jane's fate was sealed for me when she said 'I knew you would'. Was considering saving her from Kenny, but that was just the confirmation that she knew exactly how Kenny would respond and she relied on her emotional manipulation of Clem to dig her out of the mess she got herself into. Someone who intentionally incites violence like that deserves whatever happens to them.
Kenny's not the sanest for sure, but his heart is undoubtedly in the right place, whereas Jane's sanity and genuine decency is all up in the air at that point. A more sympathetic character would have made a similar scenario a much harder decision cough Luke.
In a sinister way, it was like the fight Jane created was some sort of sick competition over ownership of Clementine. Ergo, why I highly value my 'Alone' ending. Nobody owns my Clemmy-clue.
Mm. And she did that non-stop throughout, even when my Clem got embroiled into the conflict. How very caring of her to keep it going (irony, m'kay). In various different ways, she would make no more superior a guardian to Clem than crazy-ass Kenny would have. And she's supposed to be sane so what's her excuse?
Clementine is motherfucking Clementine, she doesn't need luck or skills to survive. Besides what did Jane teach Clem? Nothing, Clem already knew about the knee thing, she killed a walker or two walkers with that trick in episode 2. Jane could have used her gun to kill the walkers nearby, there is no way she had no ammo. Jane left Clem in the middle of the bizzard, she could have come back to get her, walkers were slow, but no, she didn't care if she got lost, she wanted to leave to find a way to show her how reckless Kenny is. In ep3, she completely didn't care for Clem as she said "You guys better hurry up and get the smearing if you wanna live or you can die here, it doesn't matter to me"
Tell me, did Lee ever manipulate Clem to kill her own friends? Did Lee ever leave Clem? Did Lee ever make an offer to someone, for example, Lilly or Carley, after his brother's death?
If there was ever a choice between Lee and Jane, who you save?
If you carry your sister ( who I mind you Jamie didn't want to go on anymore) then that means you're like Lee in my book yea Lee didn't lea… moreve clem but Jane came back to Clem if you played the game she comes back, she is teaching you how to live and that you have to do things on your own you also teach her in the prosses, Jane is what you call a lone wolf but give them the reasons to sat and they will
If you ask Jane to help sarah she goes and TRIES then a PEICE of wood drops on her head and the zombies get to close
so what Luke fucking agreed that's on Luke HE KNEW HE SHOULD HAVE PATROLLED that's on Luke not Jane Luke is a big boy he COULD HAVE REFUSED! luke put them in danger Jane just asked that's all
Jane is 100% Lee in my opinion and how I played the game
I let them fight it out, it's funny even when you only help Jane during the fight, Kenny always wins.
To be honest i still like both characters, but i think Janes stupid plan just shows that she doesen't think Clem can make her own decissions. I mean manipulating you into killing a old friend using a baby? That is some psycho shit and didn't suit her charakter at all imo.
Kenny may be a hot headed nut at times, but he isen't a manipulator so I usually choose his ending.
Shame they kinda ruined Janes charakter with that scene imo.
How are you not tired of fighting over this, it made me stop visiting forums lol
Anyway someone will love Jane, someone will love Kenny, someone will hate either, that's their opinion which they are entitled to.
I did in the game what i would do in real life.
Jane still gave kenny a way out she told him to go he was insane and was't going to stop till she was dead. She did want him gone but was't going to kill him till the end of the fight that was when she realized that was the only way he could ever stop
We're talking about Clementine here, not Jane. Jane killing Kenny is murder. Kenny killing Jane is murder. But Clementine, a little girl who… more was trying to stop one adult from killing another adult, and who did not know for sure at that moment that any situation had been forced, did not commit murder; it was defense of another.
I agree lol. When I said, "Jane killing Kenny is murder" I was referring to the overall situation lol. But yes, I agree with you that Jane didn't want to necessarily kill Kenny from the beginning of the fight.
Jane still gave kenny a way out she told him to go he was insane and was't going to stop till she was dead. She did want him gone but was't … moregoing to kill him till the end of the fight that was when she realized that was the only way he could ever stop
Clementine is motherfucking Clementine, she doesn't need luck or skills to survive. Besides what did Jane teach Clem? Nothing, Clem already … moreknew about the knee thing, she killed a walker or two walkers with that trick in episode 2. Jane could have used her gun to kill the walkers nearby, there is no way she had no ammo. Jane left Clem in the middle of the bizzard, she could have come back to get her, walkers were slow, but no, she didn't care if she got lost, she wanted to leave to find a way to show her how reckless Kenny is. In ep3, she completely didn't care for Clem as she said "You guys better hurry up and get the smearing if you wanna live or you can die here, it doesn't matter to me"
Tell me, did Lee ever manipulate Clem to kill her own friends? Did Lee ever leave Clem? Did Lee ever make an offer to someone, for example, Lilly or Carley, after his brother's death?
If there was ever a choice between Lee and Jane, who you save?
I agree, why save her lol. I chose Kenny anyway, but she did tell you not to do anything. I think it's fine to watch her get strangled by Kenny. Seeing as she put a baby in a cold car, that could've died...
Comments
To bad Kenny's not the fucking boss of Clem, and doesn't get to make her decisions. No matter how delusional he is or how much he tries to control and manipulate her.
It did happen right after she put her knife away. At the very beginning of the fight.
Of course defender of others is a real thing. You'd be awfully stupid to not think so, but that wasn't what I was saying. I'll just leave it at this anyway.
Just saying he wouldn't leave her. I'm not pro-kenny or pro-jane I was just pointing out that regardless of what clem wanted Kenny wouldn't leave her with someone he suspected of letting a kid die.
Honestly I'd think that Jane may have just ran away and stopped somewhere nearby and gone back to put Clementine out of her misery and attempt to save Luke and Sarah but since the scenario required 2 people pushing and 1 holding the door, I think none of them would've lived if Clementine actually died at this point.
Preeeeetty much. XD
True, But not true. It was still Luke who made the choice. If you were doing something important, and A friend of yours said, "Let's go vandalize shit." and you said yes, That's not your friends fault, That's on you.
Nevermind, I misunderstood what he was saying.
If you carry your sister ( who I mind you Jamie didn't want to go on anymore) then that means you're like Lee in my book yea Lee didn't leave clem but Jane came back to Clem if you played the game she comes back, she is teaching you how to live and that you have to do things on your own you also teach her in the prosses, Jane is what you call a lone wolf but give them the reasons to sat and they will
If you ask Jane to help sarah she goes and TRIES then a PEICE of wood drops on her head and the zombies get to close
so what Luke fucking agreed that's on Luke HE KNEW HE SHOULD HAVE PATROLLED that's on Luke not Jane Luke is a big boy he COULD HAVE REFUSED! luke put them in danger Jane just asked that's all
Jane is 100% Lee in my opinion and how I played the game
Yeah, but she soon changed her mind once the fight progressed, didn't she?
'Clem... help!'
I couldn't be deeper in agreement. I like to think that my Lee taught my Clem better than that.
I always found the dynamic with Jane and Luke's little ahem 'rendezvous' extremely beneficial to their character development. It simultaneously dismantled the 'perfect Luke' that we were being force-fed in addition to leading us to rethink our notion of Jane as some kind of people repelling stone. As for blame... I was more mad at Luke, to be honest. Probably just because I expected more from him. When Jane said she was leaving, I felt relief because of the entire situation that occurred between the two.
It doesn't seem fair to say that there was no build-up. Though they had little onscreen time together, Luke did express his intrigue towards Jane earlier in the episode. Besides, I figured that the event was also intended to be seemingly out of nowhere in order to startle us and conflict our feelings on Jane leaving a bit more.
And was I the only one who felt that the intensity with which Jane felt endeared towards Clem was obsessive and a tad unsettling?
In a sinister way, it was like the fight Jane created was some sort of sick competition over ownership of Clementine. Ergo, why I highly value my 'Alone' ending. Nobody owns my Clemmy-clue.
Mm. And she did that non-stop throughout, even when my Clem got embroiled into the conflict. How very caring of her to keep it going (irony, m'kay). In various different ways, she would make no more superior a guardian to Clem than crazy-ass Kenny would have. And she's supposed to be sane so what's her excuse?
Clementine is motherfucking Clementine, she doesn't need luck or skills to survive. Besides what did Jane teach Clem? Nothing, Clem already knew about the knee thing, she killed a walker or two walkers with that trick in episode 2. Jane could have used her gun to kill the walkers nearby, there is no way she had no ammo. Jane left Clem in the middle of the bizzard, she could have come back to get her, walkers were slow, but no, she didn't care if she got lost, she wanted to leave to find a way to show her how reckless Kenny is. In ep3, she completely didn't care for Clem as she said "You guys better hurry up and get the smearing if you wanna live or you can die here, it doesn't matter to me"
Tell me, did Lee ever manipulate Clem to kill her own friends? Did Lee ever leave Clem? Did Lee ever make an offer to someone, for example, Lilly or Carley, after his brother's death?
If there was ever a choice between Lee and Jane, who you save?
I let them fight it out, it's funny even when you only help Jane during the fight, Kenny always wins.
To be honest i still like both characters, but i think Janes stupid plan just shows that she doesen't think Clem can make her own decissions. I mean manipulating you into killing a old friend using a baby? That is some psycho shit and didn't suit her charakter at all imo.
Kenny may be a hot headed nut at times, but he isen't a manipulator so I usually choose his ending.
Shame they kinda ruined Janes charakter with that scene imo.
How are you not tired of fighting over this, it made me stop visiting forums lol
Anyway someone will love Jane, someone will love Kenny, someone will hate either, that's their opinion which they are entitled to.
I did in the game what i would do in real life.
Jane still gave kenny a way out she told him to go he was insane and was't going to stop till she was dead. She did want him gone but was't going to kill him till the end of the fight that was when she realized that was the only way he could ever stop
I agree lol. When I said, "Jane killing Kenny is murder" I was referring to the overall situation lol. But yes, I agree with you that Jane didn't want to necessarily kill Kenny from the beginning of the fight.
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Why would you not want to save the second most important character in the game, Jane?
I agree, why save her lol. I chose Kenny anyway, but she did tell you not to do anything. I think it's fine to watch her get strangled by Kenny. Seeing as she put a baby in a cold car, that could've died...
plus...she's psycho and manipulative....