I cheated and I feel guilty
I did not rewind at all during season one. I felt like I always did the right thing as Lee. In season two I rewinded four times because I couldn't face continuing with some of the choices I made, and now I feel guilty for effectively "playing God" and changing what I already did. Maybe it sounds stupid, but I'm sure some people feel the same. It makes me feel bad to know that I basically "corrected" the mistakes I should have lived with.
The first time I rewinded was actually over a rather trivial point. It was because I told Nick not to tell the truth about the man he killed on the bridge, and I felt like Clem should not tell people to be dishonest. No biggie really.
The second was when I cut off Sarita's arm at the end of episode 3. I'm sure many players did this because Reggie said that immediately cutting his arm off saved his life after being bitten. Then when I played episode 4, I saw that she died immediately afterwards, and Kenny got really mad at Clem. I couldn't have this happen to poor Clem and Sarita! I rewinded and killed the walker instead.
The third was right at the end of episode 4, I told the group we should head out as soon as possible rather than wait for Rebecca to recover. She dies at the end of the episode, and I felt so bad for basically bringing this upon her, so I rewinded and said to wait a few days. I don't think I was expecting this to change the ending of episode 4, but this time I didn't feel quite as responsible for her death when it happened.
Finally when Luke died in episode 5 I initially covered him as he wanted, then broke the ice to try rescuing him. Of course, we all know now that Luke dies no matter what, but this time I felt bad for what I did to Clementine than what I did to someone else. When I saw her looking really frail and in pain after being rescued, I rewinded and did the same, except I didn't completely break the ice. At least this time I knew Luke could see I still tried rescuing him (I know it sounds like I'm talking about these people like they're real, but I guess that goes to show how much this game matters to me). Now Bonnie was also dead for some reason, but none of it was Clem's fault, and I felt better knowing that she was physically ok in the next scene. Her mental state is a different question.
I went for the Wellington ending, and while it was a happy ending (sort of) I'm beginning to think I should have gone for the alone with AJ ending. The main reason being I should have defended Jane, even if I hated what she did and didn't care for her as much as I did Kenny. But I feel like I'm cheating if I do that, and I now regret rewinding in the four instances I've mentioned. I'm feeling like I should live with the consequences of my actions in the game, just like I do in real life. I even felt like I was "cheating" when I watched the alternate endings on YouTube. I think I care too much for Clementine and what other characters think of her in the game.
What do you guys think? Have you ever rewinded to "fix" a mistake you made, and if you did, did you feel bad about doing so?
Comments
If you feel guilty then just rewind back and choose your original choices :P
I've tried rewinding once.
It was in episode 5, when Luke tells you he's upset. I chose to tell bonnie that, I figured we should all be open, and he looks really hurt.
I think rewinding is fine, but only really as long as your opinions have changed, not because of metagaming!
Lots of people rewound after they found out jane wasn't telling the truth, which isn't really in the spirit of the game.
Just have at it. If you make a choice and you generally feel bad about it, change it if you really want to. Ain't no reason to feel like a asshole in real life because of something you did in a game.
Yeah I know, it's pretty stupid. This game has affected me far more than I could have ever imagined. I love it for that, but it did make me rather depressed when I felt like I did the wrong thing. It felt so real to me... it was the most immersed I've ever been while playing a game/watching a movie. I read one blog from someone who said they had a panic attack when having to choose between sitting with Luke or Kenny in episode 2, and while I never had a panic attack during the game I sympathise with them completely.
Exactly that's what I'm getting at, you shouldn't know the consequences of your actions before you make them! You should have good judgement and think about what will happen next, rather than know what will happen next.
I've pondered about that. I think I may do a new playthrough when it comes out on PS4, and pick my first options
When I think about it, I think a lot of it stems from the fact that Clementine's just a child. I didn't know this about myself before playing TWD, but I think I find watching a child suffer really, really painful. So I feel like "playing God" to make her life as painless as it can be. And the reason I feel guilty is because that isn't possible in real life.
It's not cheating. Rewind is there for a reason.
Why rewind when you got one of the correct endings?
Oh god. This "rewinding is cheating" craziness again.
Who made you feel rewinding was cheating in the first place ?
Cheating is going against the rules or manipulate game glitches, or use codes that the game creators originally intended for testing purposes and did not remove, in order to bypass levels or to gain an undeserved advantage against competitors.
Telltale implemented the rewind feature, it's not hidden, it's there for players to use it. They intend players to use it and enjoy it.
AndTelltale games are games where you can't cheat because they aren't games like others.
Telltale games aren't about achieving a "high score" or beating other players : it's about experiencing feelings and enjoying a good story that you can tailor the way you want.
You can enjoy and experience a Telltale story the way you f*cking want.
Example of what would be cheating in TTG : finding a way (code, glitch) to automatically succeed QTEs or solve puzzles (there is none btw)
Some people think of TTG as "life simulation", where you are obligated to stick with your choices because "you can't rewind in life". To those people I will tell this : from the first death your Lee died from a failed QTE in season 1, you should have quit the game forever and never played it again : you died. Therefore you also should never have played season 2 since Lee's death would have prevented the chain of events that puts your Clem in S2 initial situation. Because you can't rewind or resurrect in life. Hurr durr ? But that's the exact same reasoning. And just as these people don't think it's legit to rewind even if it's implemented in the game in order for players to use it, they should disregard the fact the game resurrects their character and takes them back at the beginning of the QTE even if it's implemented in the game in order for players to benefit it.
tl;dr : You shouldn't feel guilty about it.
I was about to try disputing all of your points, but your last paragraph is very well explained. What I will say is that the game makes it very clear that the QTE deaths are non-canonical. Everything else you do in game becomes canon, and changing it feels weird to me.
I'll try to explain myself differently. Maybe this comparison is too abstract but I'd like to compare it to the Star Wars special edition changes. For example, when Darth Vader shouts "NO!" in the Blu ray release of Return of the Jedi. It doesn't feel right to us, it doesn't feel canonical, because we know what it's supposed to be. He's supposed to make a silent sacrifice. Therefore when I make a change in TWD it's like I'm changing something that should have been left as it was. My initial decisions should be canon, because that's what I did first. I hope you understand what I'm getting at
If you want to have your own personal rules or "code" as to how you play TTG, I have nothing against that as long as you view it as nothing other than a personal point of view on the matter. If you feel like you'd be cheating, I can't disagree with a feeling.
I don't like people calling it cheating because it shames people who do it, when it should not. It is and should remain a very personal point of view. I thought perhaps you were thinking this way because you read so many people saying it's cheat that you were influenced, and wanted to give you an opportunity to see things differently.
And was also writing for other people to give them the same opportunity.
(And in case I sound like I'm someone who rewinds a lot and doesn't feel comfortable about it so I'd want to justify myself, it's not even the case.)
I only ever rewinded with the Sarita's arm choice, I originally cut it off, before Amid The Ruins released I changed to kill the Walker instead.
Still wish I could have shot Arvo, or shot Kenny in the arm (instead of killing him) then if Jane tried to kill him I'd have shot Jane too. I can't see myself shooting Kenny to kill (though I did to see all the endings, and the first time I shot Kenny and it killed him - thought she would have just shot him in the arm)
Oh yeah absolutely, if anyone wants to rewind of course, do it! I made this thread because I wondered if anyone else regretted rewinding for the same reasons I did. I'm not labelling anyone who does it as being a "cheater", I'm just labelling myself as one. I'm relatively new to posting on this forum and I haven't actually seen anyone comment that rewinding is a bad thing to do. And I'm not saying it is. I'm saying it's bad for me.
I gotta say though you've made me feel less negative about it. Again it may sound stupid that I'm getting all philosophical about a game, of all things. But this game has had an unprecedented impact on me, one so great that no other game (or any art medium, for that matter) has done the same to me since the first Walking Dead.
I don't like to rewind the story, although I admit to having done it a few times.. but only to change small things in history. never a very significant event. These I forbade me to change. xD
I think the great beauty of this game is the fact that you must make decisions and be responsible for it, no matter what your choice. like in real life. that's what makes this game so exciting and intense.
If you get to aways rewind your story based on what others have done, or because you think that other way will be better. then your Clementine will going to lose her originality, because she will no longer be truly based on what you. as a player, decided.
In the end I didn't regret any of my choices. because I did what I thought right for my Clem. and that's enough for me. xD
Yeah, the first time through I shot Kenny. I felt awful about it. But then I got to thinking about it afterward and I realized that in a real life scenario, I probably wouldn't have been able to shoot Kenny. Not with lethal intent, anyway. So I rewound and fixed it and now I feel much better about it.
I don't get people who get upset about this at all.
Like the first go around a tried to help Larry in the meatlocker but then I stopped and thought "Wait a minute, I don't know how long it takes for someone to reanimate, CPR almost certainly isn't going to revive someone who's in a complete cardiac arrest, this is stupid and would realistically get everyone in here killed" and so I changed it.
Really great points. I particularly like what you said about Clem being based on the player.
Shooting him in the arm would've been a great fourth option in that scene (the third one is where you don't make a choice and you watch Kenny kill her). Alas, we either have to kill him or let him live, and because of that it makes the choice infinitely more difficult to make. I'm sure someone at TT said "what if the player can just injure him?" but then someone else said "you know what, no, let's make this really hard for them!" Then they both looked at each other both thinking "oh, I know what you're thinking" and then BAM, the entire forum is one giant debate! Damn you Telltale for crafting such a brilliant game!
I think you should consider some of the differences between the game world and the real world. When you're in a game world, you don't necessarily expect reality to work the way it does in the real world. Let's use cutting off Sarita's arm as an example. Initially when I was presented with that choice I too chose to cut off Sarita's arm. It seemed like the sensible thing to do. But in a real life scenario, I might have judged differently. I may very well have thought to myself: "Hmm... We're surrounded by walkers and if I cut off her arm, blood is going to go everywhere and she is going to scream bloody murder." But being in a game world created by Telltale, I didn't consider these things. Why? Probably partly because video games (even realistic ones) tend to bend reality a bit. They ignore serious wounds, climate/temperature, and various other things when it is convenient or necessary to the plot. I don't blame them for it but the fact remains that it does happen.
So don't beat yourself up about it! I probably rewound at least as many times as you and over things that were less important. Also, remember that in the real world there is more flexibility. If you say something stupid you can rectify it by apologizing or saying that you didn't mean it or that it wasn't really what you meant. In TWD, once you push a button, you're pretty much locked into that decision. Unless you rewind!
Indeed, I'm not sure I would've cut her arm off in real life either. I probably wouldn't even make it that far. I would've been the walker that made Lee shout "F***ING DRIVE!" in S1 E1.
Anyway about the point about more flexibility, I think I feel the burden more than I should precisely because I can't apologise for my actions in the game (I guess sometimes it lets you though). In a way, the rewinding feature replaces the apology feature that real life gives us
That was a very weird sentence to type
I feel your pain!!
I felt so guilty of shooting Kenny,I couldn't forgive Myself and I was broken IRL.
I finally rewinded to stay at Wellington,and I felt satisfied.
Haha, yeah, I probably wouldn't have lived past day one of the outbreak!
It may be a weird sentence, but it's fairly accurate I think! I know what you mean about feeling the burden of your actions. This game really gets ahold of you. I really agonize over some of the decisions I've made.
Also, I know that sometimes I choose a dialogue option and Lee/Clementine says it in a much different way than I was expecting, completely changing the meaning of the dialogue. Another good reason to include rewind.
It's true, sometimes she doesn't say what you might expect her to. I like to think of the options as being the thoughts going on in her mind, and when she tries to put your chosen thought into words it sometimes doesn't come out right. Shocking revelation: we're not playing as Clementine, we're playing as her bRAAAIINNN, or more specifically, her cortex
You didn't cheat. Telltale added the rewind feature in there for a reason, no need to feel bad about it.
wait.... fourth option?
I thought there were only two options - kill Kenny or do nothing (and Kenny kills Jane with the knife as a result).
In any case yeah, I just think it would have been a good option to let her shoot Kenny, then Jane tries to kill Kenny, and Clem can either shoot Jane or not (in which case she kills Kenny). It just seemed to be more consistent with how Clem would NOT shoot to kill Kenny. But would still allow the option of Jane surviving if you're one of the four people to play the game that wants Jane to be the one who lives after what she did.
I totally agree that it does make the choice harder.
If you really want to feel cheated and guilty,meet me in the alleyway behind starbucks.
You just left Luke there? How could you do that?
You're even worse than Kenny.
My original ending was the Jane and Family ending, and I rewinded to get the Kenny and Aj one. I'll be sticking with my original Jane ending for season 3 though, because I treat the game like life. Clem can't just rewind time and correct her mistakes, she needs to continue on.
I like that a player named EthicsAndMorality originally shot Kenny to stop him from murdering Jane, but then rewound it and feels much better about Clem being an accomplice to murder. It makes me wonder what your Intro to Ethics and Morality course would look like.
As I said the third option is don't choose either, and you watch Kenny stab her.
I admire your dedication to stick with it! It's really hard in some places
There are NO CORRECT/WRONG ENDINGS. Jesus. Its all about #yourClementine. She might not be the same as #MyClementine.
You didn't actually cheat you know, it's an option the game gives you, therefore it's not really 'cheating'.
I'm not sure there is a morally right thing for her to do in that scene. Yes, to kill Kenny is to kill a murderer and protect Jane, but there are other factors to consider. Jane wanted to fight him, she could have ended up killing him instead. Maybe Clem didn't want to make that decision herself. Or maybe Clem didn't want to go as low as Kenny and kill another human. Maybe she just wanted to be a pacifist, even if it meant Jane doesn't get justice.
In the end whichever you think "morally right" thing to do is probably the one you ended up picking. I'm personally having second thoughts about the one I chose.
Dying from a QTE is different then not rewinding. If I died at the start, I'm not going to stop playing, That's crazy. Not rewinding is trying to make the game a bit more realistic and stay true to the choices you have made. Making a choice then rewinding it once you know what happens is cheating in my opinion.