Chyeah, pretty much. Until ANF comes along, in which case it's "I don't know anything about these characters! Season One was so much better because people talked about their feelings!!"
Yep.
Yeah, seriously. I just checked out after that point for a while cause it went by so fast and I just had very little fucks to give at that point. Knowing she and Tripp died in advance may or may not have softened the blow.
Though the fact they had to do that to her to make what they did with Tripp(a lesser character in just about every way) standout is dirty.
I hear that. It's kind of a good thing that Ava was dead in my playthrough. (Oh Joan, you were just trying to save me from her pathetic alternate death)
I think everyone was excepting a big bearded guy like Tripp to go out fighting a bunch of zombies. I never knew what they were going to do with Ava, but lemme tell ya they did worse than I would have ever expected.
I would have been happier if they had literally copy and pasted her over Tripp's model fighting the zombies. Something like that just makes you think that they preferred one character over the other.
I suppose. At the same time though, I was willing to forgive it this time since ANF was seemingly trying to be a smaller, more streamlined story compared to Season 1 and especially Season 2. And given my theories as to her role after Part 2, having her be second in command to David with such a non-standard design would've worked out perfectly dramatically speaking.
yet it also wanted so much to be bigger, grander, an epic walking dead tale if there was one.
That make sense, but only again if you assume they're too lazy to give background characters good designs. Which they were. I guess I had too much faith.
Agreed, though there were both trailers and next time segments in previous episodes. I think it's safe to assume they removed them primarily because of all the heavy, on-going rewrites. But really, the bait and switch ended up feeling like a waste of time anyway thanks to From the Gallows.
Makes sense. I mean it's false advertising. But really, David was the closest thing to a villain in episode 5, so it wasn't entirely a lie when you think about it.
That's how you do effective foreshadowing and/or retconning, if I do say so myself. Have her suggest the town seemingly out of the blue on the notion that it has "some good people there," then have her determinately encounter Conrad in the finale and reveal that they're actually related, shining some new light on certain innocuous plot points and character traits.
so why was she there in the first place? how did she find out conrad was her papa?
It was likely the latter, given that the Cabin Group themselves are/were just four different families. We just didn't get to see many of them during In Harm's Way outside of Shel and Becca's determinate cameo.
Place was pretty damn empty, though with headphones on you can hear some sounds in the background that make it sound a bit larger. Still don't know about there being whole families but I know there's been fanfictions with that premise. Maybe they removed the idea because that would involve the protags damning how many innocent people to the herd? (oh becca and shel don't count, no one likes them. :P) Everyone else we saw was a guard except those two, interesting enough. oh and that unseen mechanic guy.
Also they'd have to make/remodel a crap-ton of characters, that probably factored in to the decision.
Yeah, pretty much. They'd have to radically revitalize her character if they were to bring her back for whatever reason and you'd might as well make a new character at that point.
it would be kinda funny though.
"Clem, It's ME, Becca!"
"who?"
"you know? you saw me for like ten seconds in season 2?"
"we're really running out of story ideas here."
Actually, I think Virginia is technically in the North, but I think Conrad is originally from South. Anyway, looking back, I think you meant it in a less freudian way and just took what you said too literally, in which case yes, that would be kinda sweet. Or sad, considering Ava ends up dying, but hey!
I'll admit I've pretty much lost all the knowledge of geography I once had in grade school. Forgot it all. But I could never remember characters saying where they were in season 2 or 3, specifically. Guess my eyes glazed over during those parts.
And hey, obviously in that "rewrite" Ava doesn't die. No way someone like her dies that way.
"Be careful"
Admittedly, I sometimes take about 30 minutes to do a single reply myself..
I try to do everything time-efficiently, but that sometimes affects the quality of my replies. Alas, I lose either way.
Oh, Heh. Yes, it could have. I'd hope not, but it could have.
There's the thing, just because these concepts and ideas are different doesn't mean they wouldn't fall prey to similar problems and faulty executions.
"I didn't buy a zombie apocalypse game to have a little girl talk about her feeeeelings!"
Chyeah, pretty much. Until ANF comes along… more, in which case it's "I don't know anything about these characters! Season One was so much better because people talked about their feelings!!"
Yep.
....
Why couldn't she have gone out better, oh man her death is the most demeaning ridiculous shit ever.
Yeah, seriously. I just checked out after that point for a while cause it went by so fast and I just had very little fucks to give at that point. Knowing she and Tripp died in advance may or may not have softened the blow.
Though the fact they had to do that to her to make what they did with Tripp(a lesser character in just about every way) standout is dirty.
Yeah, but problem with that is the classic everyone you meet is super important syndrome. It makes the universe feel smaller and less realistic. But eh, it's not like it's … [view original content]
I hear that. It's kind of a good thing that Ava was dead in my playthrough. (Oh Joan, you were just trying to save me from her pathetic alternate death)
Considering Joan herself can catch a bullet in the eye(ow) for that, that is an interesting way of looking at it.
I think everyone was excepting a big bearded guy like Tripp to go out fighting a bunch of zombies. I never knew what they were going to do with Ava, but lemme tell ya they did worse than I would have ever expected.
I would have been happier if they had literally copy and pasted her over Tripp's model fighting the zombies. Something like that just makes you think that they preferred one character over the other.
Pretty much. I assumed she and determinately Gabe would backup David on what he was going to do after he caught up to Joan/Clint, with both trying to mediate his aggression a bit but still supporting him throughout.
yet it also wanted so much to be bigger, grander, an epic walking dead tale if there was one.
That make sense, but only again if you assume they're too lazy to give background characters good designs. Which they were. I guess I had too much faith.
True as well. And characters like Shades-Chick have something of a following for reasons.
Makes sense. I mean it's false advertising. But really, David was the closest thing to a villain in episode 5, so it wasn't entirely a lie when you think about it.
Maybe, but the degree of which he became the Big Bad and how it was executed is the big issue. Honestly, it feels like a problem some people had with Carver magnified in intensity, but you can say something similar about a lot of things.
so why was she there in the first place? how did she find out conrad was her papa?
If by there, you mean Prescott, then she obviously learned at some point(probably through Joan's diplomatic visits or something) that Conrad was living there and a small part of her still cared about him. And she'd obviously know he was her dad because he raised her up until sometime after she became a teenager and they had some sort of falling out that had her leave to eventually join the New Frontier(as I didn't know about the line where David says she was in army for a while).
"If I were you, I'd give him some space. Just my advice--one parent to another."
Place was pretty damn empty, though with headphones on you can hear some sounds in the background that make it sound a bit larger. Still don't know about there being whole families but I know there's been fanfictions with that premise. Maybe they removed the idea because that would involve the protags damning how many innocent people to the herd? (oh becca and shel don't count, no one likes them. :P) Everyone else we saw was a guard except those two, interesting enough. oh and that unseen mechanic guy.
Also they'd have to make/remodel a crap-ton of characters, that probably factored in to the decision.
Pretty much.
it would be kinda funny though.
"Clem, It's ME, Becca!"
"who?"
"you know? you saw me for like ten seconds in season 2?"
"we're really running out of story ideas here."
How meta.
I'll admit I've pretty much lost all the knowledge of geography I once had in grade school. Forgot it all. But I could never remember characters saying where they were in season 2 or 3, specifically. Guess my eyes glazed over during those parts.
Well, Season 1 is clearly in Georgia, there's a North Carolina sign at Christa and Clementine's campsite, and I'm pretty sure Richmond is in Virginia, so there's that much. Everything else is left up in the air outside of a few context clues--The Unfinished House is the biggest offender of that.
And hey, obviously in that "rewrite" Ava doesn't die. No way someone like her dies that way.
"Be careful"
Ah yes, that makes more sense.
There's the thing, just because these concepts and ideas are different doesn't mean they wouldn't fall prey to similar problems and faulty executions.
Yeah, this game series actually has a number of problems that get worse with each installment.
Chyeah, pretty much. Until ANF comes along, in which case it's "I don't know anything about these characters! Season One was so much better … morebecause people talked about their feelings!!"
Yep.
Yeah, seriously. I just checked out after that point for a while cause it went by so fast and I just had very little fucks to give at that point. Knowing she and Tripp died in advance may or may not have softened the blow.
Though the fact they had to do that to her to make what they did with Tripp(a lesser character in just about every way) standout is dirty.
I hear that. It's kind of a good thing that Ava was dead in my playthrough. (Oh Joan, you were just trying to save me from her pathetic alternate death)
I think everyone was excepting a big bearded guy like Tripp to go out fighting a bunch of zombies. I never knew what they were going to do with Ava, but lemme tell ya they did worse than I would have ever expected.
I would … [view original content]
1.- Clementine, she is by far the most overrated character of this franchise! everyone treats her as if she were a f%cking Goddess! i hope she dies in the final season.
2.- Christa.
3.- Lilly.
Kate (Her character is boring to me and I find her annoying. That's all really.)
I don't know why you bothered listing her since people usually shit on her here.
Christa (She seems insensitive and nosy, and I don't understand why people want her back so much.)
Because she was ultimately looking out for Clementine's safety just as much as Christa Jr.'s and more or less used herself as a distraction to prevent Victor and "Ralph" from capturing her before she disappeared.
Maybe, but the degree of which he became the Big Bad and how it was executed is the big issue. Honestly, it feels like a problem some people had with Carver magnified in intensity, but you can say something similar about a lot of things.
I know. All this complaining, all the story issues that we go through again and again, it takes a toll. How long are we going to keep it up?
(as I didn't know about the line where David says she was in army for a while).
But wasn't that line non-optional? Doesn't David tell you this as you two are walking away from her?
How meta.
in honesty though, despite my lousy joke, the video game series hasn't worn as thin as the comic series. That shit needs to fucking end already. Enough recycling plots and having new ridiculous villains pop up. Just kill Rick, and have his son get with the girl that's been there from the beginning but he's been ignoring.
Hmph
It's not a slight, it's just that those characters were mostly wasted or inconsistently written.
I was looking at "all that remains" again, and luke's character baffled me. Why did they have Pete be the one to trust her, and Luke be a dick to her when she's bitten?
1. this is a good oppurtunity to set up luke and clem's trusting relationship
2. if you're just going to kill pete off, why have him be the one who trusts her
3. it makes sense, the young emotional dude endangering everyone and the grizzled older man disapproving, but no it's the reverse. Let's not forgot that Nick's mother was also PETE'S SISTER, but that doesn't seem to bother him too much.
4. LITERALLY FIVE MINUTES LATER, LUKE SUDDENLY TRUSTS CLEM. it's almost like they accidentally reversed their roles for that scene.
Seriously, the first half of season 1 is so disjointed and rushed. The second half may feel a bit detached from the first, and have some forced scenes like kenny vs jane, but it does feel more tightly written and focused to me. They also improved the dialogue options a bit.
When you're talking to Nick by Matthew's shack, he freaking goes through mood swings being angry, depressed, and then hopeful in like a minute. I know, that sounds like it's intentional when I write it out, but it in the actual game it feels like a series of lines strung together awkwardly to form a dialogue/scene. It's so jarring.
I hear that. It's kind of a good thing that Ava was dead in my playthrough. (Oh Joan, you were just trying to save me from her pathetic alte… morernate death)
Considering Joan herself can catch a bullet in the eye(ow) for that, that is an interesting way of looking at it.
I think everyone was excepting a big bearded guy like Tripp to go out fighting a bunch of zombies. I never knew what they were going to do with Ava, but lemme tell ya they did worse than I would have ever expected.
I would have been happier if they had literally copy and pasted her over Tripp's model fighting the zombies. Something like that just makes you think that they preferred one character over the other.
Pretty much. I assumed she and determinately Gabe would backup David on what he was going to do after he caught up to Joan/Clint, with both trying to mediate his aggression a bit but still supporting him throughout.
yet it also wanted so much… [view original content]
I know. All this complaining, all the story issues that we go through again and again, it takes a toll. How long are we going to keep it up?
For one more Season/Installment, apparently.
But wasn't that line non-optional? Doesn't David tell you this as you two are walking away from her?
No, I'm pretty sure he just said he met up with her when it all started and he wouldn't have made it without her(Lee and Clementine, anyone?). Though he commented "The woman is a fuckin soldier," I just assumed it was a compliment, given David is an army guy and all.
in honesty though, despite my lousy joke, the video game series hasn't worn as thin as the comic series. That shit needs to fucking end already. Enough recycling plots and having new ridiculous villains pop up. Just kill Rick, and have his son get with the girl that's been there from the beginning but he's been ignoring.
Sounds about right, I guess.
It's not a slight, it's just that those characters were mostly wasted or inconsistently written.
I was looking at "all that remains" again, and luke's character baffled me. Why did they have Pete be the one to trust her, and Luke be a dick to her when she's bitten?
1. this is a good oppurtunity to set up luke and clem's trusting relationship
2. if you're just going to kill pete off, why have him be the one who trusts her
3. it makes sense, the young emotional dude endangering everyone and the grizzled older man disapproving, but no it's the reverse. Let's not forgot that Nick's mother was also PETE'S SISTER, but that doesn't seem to bother him too much.
4. LITERALLY FIVE MINUTES LATER, LUKE SUDDENLY TRUSTS CLEM. it's almost like they accidentally reversed their roles for that scene.
You know, I considered the alternate once myself, but I think it makes more sense given that Luke seemed like he was supposed be an up and coming leader and thus him panicking when he sees the bite was supposed to set up that he isn't as confident or maybe even heroic as he tries to be. Plus, Pete is kind of a "good-er" counterpart to Larry, so having him outright mistrust Clementine would kinda mess with that.
Seriously, the first half of season 1 is so disjointed and rushed. The second half may feel a bit detached from the first, and have some forced scenes like kenny vs jane, but it does feel more tightly written and focused to me. They also improved the dialogue options a bit.
You mean Season 2. And yes, yes it does. That's mostly because they were trying to set up some mystery for the later episodes but that fell through when Kenny was recast as a separate character, Breckon left for whatever reason, and Shorette(and the executives) took over.Unfortunately, setting things up can sometimes come at the cost of writing a tighter story, whereas the later episodes had the advantage of wrapping things up, even if it did sloppily in a few cases.
When you're talking to Nick by Matthew's shack, he freaking goes through mood swings being angry, depressed, and then hopeful in like a minute. I know, that sounds like it's intentional when I write it out, but it in the actual game it feels like a series of lines strung together awkwardly to form a dialogue/scene. It's so jarring.
Ya know, that is a fair point. For what it's worth, it felt like it actually made sense with Nick and especially Sarah since they are very emotional characters and the current circumstances helped give them context, but Alvin, on the other hand, was definitely clunky about that.
Maybe, but the degree of which he became the Big Bad and how it was executed is the big issue. Honestly, it feels like a problem some people… more had with Carver magnified in intensity, but you can say something similar about a lot of things.
I know. All this complaining, all the story issues that we go through again and again, it takes a toll. How long are we going to keep it up?
(as I didn't know about the line where David says she was in army for a while).
But wasn't that line non-optional? Doesn't David tell you this as you two are walking away from her?
How meta.
in honesty though, despite my lousy joke, the video game series hasn't worn as thin as the comic series. That shit needs to fucking end already. Enough recycling plots and having new ridiculous villains pop up. Just kill Rick, and have his son get with the girl that's been there from the beginning but he's been ignoring.
Hmph
It's not… [view original content]
Lily - She carried a lot on her shoulders and wasn't afraid to go head-to-head with anyone in the group. Also had a riveting story arc. Jane - She had a different mentality than the rest of the group and I respected that. Everyone hates her - and S3 events absolutely justify that - but a bad person does not make a bad character.
Overrated
Clementine - She was out of place in S2 due to her being like 9 yet always forced to do adult tasks. In S3 her whole character is consumed by a protect-the-baby trope. Clementine has been written into a corner and she's been riding on the coat tails of S1 for 2 seasons now. Christa - I always viewed her as a pretty typical character with some slight bossy traits, but noting special. Only when I checked the forums did I see people clamouring for her return. I don't fully get it. Michonne - Not sure if she's overrated by the fans, but the creators saw fit to give this boring ass character a whole mini-series.
Great. Well, I was thinking that a smaller more self-contained story with Clem looking for AJ would probably present less problems... but who knows at this point.
No, I'm pretty sure he just said he met up with her when it all started and he wouldn't have made it without her(Lee and Clementine, anyone?). Though he commented "The woman is a fuckin soldier," I just assumed it was a compliment, given David is an army guy and all.
...weird. But I haven't played through the game more than twice because of the issues, so I don't know if I'm misremembering or not.
Sounds about right, I guess.
I really think it should have ended shortly after Negan was defeated, with an extended epilogue or something.
You know, I considered the alternate once myself, but I think it makes more sense given that Luke seemed like he was supposed be an up and coming leader and thus him panicking when he sees the bite was supposed to set up that he isn't as confident or maybe even heroic as he tries to be. Plus, Pete is kind of a "good-er" counterpart to Larry, so having him outright mistrust Clementine would kinda mess with that.
Yeah, I know, we've discussed that aspect of Luke before. And heck, I still like Pete. But still, something about this whole scene and the following discussion rubs me the wrong way. It feels like a rough draft that needs some rewrites. Luke feels like has very little influence on Clementine, why was he even included in the season 3 recap options? That's a soft retcon.
Ya know, that is a fair point. For what it's worth, it felt like it actually made sense with Nick and especially Sarah since they are very emotional characters and the current circumstances helped give them context, but Alvin, on the other hand, was definitely clunky about that.
No doubt, the first half of season 1 is like it's on fast forward. Or sleepwalking through the scenes/going through the motions. It's like they couldn't wait to get rid of the cabin crew.
I know. All this complaining, all the story issues that we go through again and again, it takes a toll. How long are we going to keep it up?… more
For one more Season/Installment, apparently.
But wasn't that line non-optional? Doesn't David tell you this as you two are walking away from her?
No, I'm pretty sure he just said he met up with her when it all started and he wouldn't have made it without her(Lee and Clementine, anyone?). Though he commented "The woman is a fuckin soldier," I just assumed it was a compliment, given David is an army guy and all.
in honesty though, despite my lousy joke, the video game series hasn't worn as thin as the comic series. That shit needs to fucking end already. Enough recycling plots and having new ridiculous villains pop up. Just kill Rick, and have his son get with the girl that's been there from the beginning but he's been ignoring.
Sounds about right, I guess.
It's no… [view original content]
Great. Well, I was thinking that a smaller more self-contained story with Clem looking for AJ would probably present less problems... but who knows at this point.
I really think it should have ended shortly after Negan was defeated, with an extended epilogue or something.
I have no context, so whatever.
Yeah, I know, we've discussed that aspect of Luke before. And heck, I still like Pete. But still, something about this whole scene and the following discussion rubs me the wrong way. It feels like a rough draft that needs some rewrites. Luke feels like has very little influence on Clementine, why was he even included in the season 3 recap options? That's a soft retcon.
I likely because he was created specifically to interact with Clementine and learn from her, and later became her liaison within the group. Then he was relegated to mostly having a rivalry with Kenny/Carlos due to the strained screentime he got and even that went out the window when they decided to hyperfocus on Jane. Thus, Luke's intended dynamic and importancewas cut short due to being upstaged by those jerkasses and him being listed as an influence is likely both highlighting that he was the next most significant character in Season 2, his different personality and beliefs compared to them, and also acts as a bonus apology to his fans since they got cheated out of what was set up for them.
No doubt, the first half of season 1 is like it's on fast forward. Or sleepwalking through the scenes/going through the motions. It's like they couldn't wait to get rid of the cabin crew.
That may have been the case, unfortunately, given how much importance was given to Kenny and Telltale themselves apparently admitting that they knew writing a story on par with Season 1 would've been extremely difficult.
For one more Season/Installment, apparently.
Great. Well, I was thinking that a smaller more self-contained story with Clem looking … morefor AJ would probably present less problems... but who knows at this point.
No, I'm pretty sure he just said he met up with her when it all started and he wouldn't have made it without her(Lee and Clementine, anyone?). Though he commented "The woman is a fuckin soldier," I just assumed it was a compliment, given David is an army guy and all.
...weird. But I haven't played through the game more than twice because of the issues, so I don't know if I'm misremembering or not.
Sounds about right, I guess.
I really think it should have ended shortly after Negan was defeated, with an extended epilogue or something.
You know, I considered the alternate once myself, but I think it makes more sense given that Luke seemed like he was supposed be an up and coming leader and thus him … [view original content]
Underrated:
Ava
Duck
Mark
Mariana (seriously I never see anything about her anywhere)
Katjaa
Alvin
Mike
The St Johns (in my opinion … morethey're very interesting characters, resorting to c******** and everything)
Kate
Overrated:
Kenny
Luke
Jane
Nick
Bumping this in part because it's probably the perfect place to ask this redundant question: Why the fuck do you think/feel a lot of people was so sycophantic about Carver?
Tfw you google what sycophantic means but the definition just gives you more words you don’t know so you need to google them too. Probably because he was giving them a home so they knew they wouldn’t get eaten alive and he was the only one there who knew how to run a community
Bumping this in part because it's probably the perfect place to ask this redundant question: Why the fuck do you think/feel a lot of people was so sycophantic about Carver?
Bumping this in part because it's probably the perfect place to ask this redundant question: Why the fuck do you think/feel a lot of people was so sycophantic about Carver?
Tfw you google what sycophantic means but the definition just gives you more words you don’t know so you need to google them too. Probably b… moreecause he was giving them a home so they knew they wouldn’t get eaten alive and he was the only one there who knew how to run a community
Ironic you say that considering the plot was supposed to be about getting away from Carver.
So no, almost everyone introduced in Season 2 and then some.
No, it was them panicking and thinking that an army of zombies were less scary than people somehow.
Carver's still a man, it's always possible, no matter how slim, that somebody could reason with him, bring him back from the edge of the abyss. They say that he wasn't always that bad, after all. And even then, even if he doesn't change, as long as they didn't fuck up they'd have walls and food to eat. Granted, he really did have it out for Alvin and Reggie, but I'm saying it's not that Black and White. It was like Carver predicted: lambs to the slaughter, so even the writers knew this was the case. You could even make the argument the second half of the season is all about a humiliation/trauma conga line for ungrateful punks that think they know better.
I wholeheartedly agree. Even if Carver was that imminent a danger to them (which I'd argue he really wasn't), there were a million other ways they could've played the scenario, like getting Carver to have a little "accident" and show up dead so Tavia would step in or something. I'd even say that this was something they were setting up! With all the Clem getting close to him and him being so... gullible when it came to her. Should Clem agree with his ideology, whether she means it or not, he's just so quick to believe her, like he was in over his head, already convinced that Clem shared the same world view and methodology... god knows why. This could've culminated into something like Clem quickly earning his trust, becoming his pupil as he seemed to intend... and interesting decisions coming out of such situation.
I'm strongly convinced a Carver ending should've been a thing.
Instead of just sitting on their asses inside the safe and self sustainable community, our group decides to jump into a herd with a man beat to shit, an emotionally weakened woman, a guy who just lost his eye and probably suffered brain damage, two kids, one of which super dependable, and a pregnant woman. Not to mention the long term implications, like, instead of delivering the baby in a safe, stable environment, they'd be having it in the wilderness with no supplies, and even if it made it just think how easy it would be to raise a newborn by the side of the road! It really makes you question if the season 2 cast had any sensibility at all.
No, it was them panicking and thinking that an army of zombies were less scary than people somehow.
Carver's still a man, it's always poss… moreible, no matter how slim, that somebody could reason with him, bring him back from the edge of the abyss. They say that he wasn't always that bad, after all. And even then, even if he doesn't change, as long as they didn't fuck up they'd have walls and food to eat. Granted, he really did have it out for Alvin and Reggie, but I'm saying it's not that Black and White. It was like Carver predicted: lambs to the slaughter, so even the writers knew this was the case. You could even make the argument the second half of the season is all about a humiliation/trauma conga line for ungrateful punks that think they know better.
No, it was them panicking and thinking that an army of zombies were less scary than people somehow.
Uh, pretty sure that's the whole point of the Walking Dead as a whole, dude..
Carver's still a man, it's always possible, no matter how slim, that somebody could reason with him, bring him back from the edge of the abyss. They say that he wasn't always that bad, after all. And even then, even if he doesn't change, as long as they didn't fuck up they'd have walls and food to eat. Granted, he really did have it out for Alvin and Reggie, but I'm saying it's not that Black and White.
I don't know, Carver is a such lame villain/character that I honestly find it hard to take the story's word for it when it comes to him. And really, the whole thing ended up feeling almost as pretentious as him. With still more than mile to go, of course.
Show, don't tell. Or in this case, DO tell--EXPLAIN!!!
It was like Carver predicted: lambs to the slaughter, so even the writers knew this was the case. You could even make the argument the second half of the season is all about a humiliation/trauma conga line for ungrateful punks that think they know better.
Which is weird considering his men and a possible rejected apprentice were responsible for that, but whatever.
I still stand by the fact that they were kinda screwed either way with Carver being a thing, not to mention Troy crashing into the loading bay, Luke, Hank, and Bonnie mentioning that the herd was easily the biggest one they ever faced, and the fact that there were several breaches the day before.
No, it was them panicking and thinking that an army of zombies were less scary than people somehow.
Carver's still a man, it's always poss… moreible, no matter how slim, that somebody could reason with him, bring him back from the edge of the abyss. They say that he wasn't always that bad, after all. And even then, even if he doesn't change, as long as they didn't fuck up they'd have walls and food to eat. Granted, he really did have it out for Alvin and Reggie, but I'm saying it's not that Black and White. It was like Carver predicted: lambs to the slaughter, so even the writers knew this was the case. You could even make the argument the second half of the season is all about a humiliation/trauma conga line for ungrateful punks that think they know better.
With all the Clem getting close to him and him being so... gullible when it came to her. Should Clem agree with his ideology, whether she means it or not, he's just so quick to believe her, like he was in over his head, already convinced that Clem shared the same world view and methodology... god knows why.
Honestly, Carver struck me as the type of guy who thought playing chess a few times and watching Animal Planet made him smart.
This could've culminated into something like Clem quickly earning his trust, becoming his pupil as he seemed to intend... and interesting decisions coming out of such situation.
I'm strongly convinced a Carver ending should've been a thing.
I wholeheartedly agree. Even if Carver was that imminent a danger to them (which I'd argue he really wasn't), there were a million other way… mores they could've played the scenario, like getting Carver to have a little "accident" and show up dead so Tavia would step in or something. I'd even say that this was something they were setting up! With all the Clem getting close to him and him being so... gullible when it came to her. Should Clem agree with his ideology, whether she means it or not, he's just so quick to believe her, like he was in over his head, already convinced that Clem shared the same world view and methodology... god knows why. This could've culminated into something like Clem quickly earning his trust, becoming his pupil as he seemed to intend... and interesting decisions coming out of such situation.
I'm strongly convinced a Carver ending should've been a thing.
Instead of just sitting on their asses inside the safe and sel… [view original content]
Yes he did. He was certainly more engaging as a character than David, at any rate. Carver made no excuses about the kind of man he was. David was a tiresome hypocrite right out the gate.
Carver had an arc?!
Yes he did. He was certainly more engaging as a character than David, at any rate. Carver made no excuses about the kind of man he was. David was a tiresome hypocrite right out the gate.
Comments
Apparently, this guy doesn't see anyone talk about her, so I decided to point out that there has been a fair about of that here.
Clementine, I get; Lee, I do not.
Underrated: Doug, maybe Nick
Overrated: Jane..and Clementine
Yep.
Though the fact they had to do that to her to make what they did with Tripp(a lesser character in just about every way) standout is dirty.
I hear that. It's kind of a good thing that Ava was dead in my playthrough. (Oh Joan, you were just trying to save me from her pathetic alternate death)
I think everyone was excepting a big bearded guy like Tripp to go out fighting a bunch of zombies. I never knew what they were going to do with Ava, but lemme tell ya they did worse than I would have ever expected.
I would have been happier if they had literally copy and pasted her over Tripp's model fighting the zombies. Something like that just makes you think that they preferred one character over the other.
yet it also wanted so much to be bigger, grander, an epic walking dead tale if there was one.
That make sense, but only again if you assume they're too lazy to give background characters good designs. Which they were. I guess I had too much faith.
Makes sense. I mean it's false advertising. But really, David was the closest thing to a villain in episode 5, so it wasn't entirely a lie when you think about it.
so why was she there in the first place? how did she find out conrad was her papa?
Place was pretty damn empty, though with headphones on you can hear some sounds in the background that make it sound a bit larger. Still don't know about there being whole families but I know there's been fanfictions with that premise. Maybe they removed the idea because that would involve the protags damning how many innocent people to the herd? (oh becca and shel don't count, no one likes them. :P) Everyone else we saw was a guard except those two, interesting enough. oh and that unseen mechanic guy.
Also they'd have to make/remodel a crap-ton of characters, that probably factored in to the decision.
it would be kinda funny though.
"Clem, It's ME, Becca!"
"who?"
"you know? you saw me for like ten seconds in season 2?"
"we're really running out of story ideas here."
I'll admit I've pretty much lost all the knowledge of geography I once had in grade school. Forgot it all. But I could never remember characters saying where they were in season 2 or 3, specifically. Guess my eyes glazed over during those parts.
And hey, obviously in that "rewrite" Ava doesn't die. No way someone like her dies that way.
"Be careful"
I try to do everything time-efficiently, but that sometimes affects the quality of my replies. Alas, I lose either way.
There's the thing, just because these concepts and ideas are different doesn't mean they wouldn't fall prey to similar problems and faulty executions.
Criminy.
From a certain point of view, it is.
Considering Joan herself can catch a bullet in the eye(ow) for that, that is an interesting way of looking at it.
Pretty much. I assumed she and determinately Gabe would backup David on what he was going to do after he caught up to Joan/Clint, with both trying to mediate his aggression a bit but still supporting him throughout.
True as well. And characters like Shades-Chick have something of a following for reasons.
Maybe, but the degree of which he became the Big Bad and how it was executed is the big issue. Honestly, it feels like a problem some people had with Carver magnified in intensity, but you can say something similar about a lot of things.
If by there, you mean Prescott, then she obviously learned at some point(probably through Joan's diplomatic visits or something) that Conrad was living there and a small part of her still cared about him. And she'd obviously know he was her dad because he raised her up until sometime after she became a teenager and they had some sort of falling out that had her leave to eventually join the New Frontier(as I didn't know about the line where David says she was in army for a while).
"If I were you, I'd give him some space. Just my advice--one parent to another."
Pretty much.
Well, Season 1 is clearly in Georgia, there's a North Carolina sign at Christa and Clementine's campsite, and I'm pretty sure Richmond is in Virginia, so there's that much. Everything else is left up in the air outside of a few context clues--The Unfinished House is the biggest offender of that.
Ah yes, that makes more sense.
Yeah, this game series actually has a number of problems that get worse with each installment.
Hmph.
Mariana has to be the most beloved character of s3 and she wasn't even in one full episode, she's largely overrated
Yeah, but considering how much ANF did wrong, she got off lucky.
Overrated
1.- Clementine, she is by far the most overrated character of this franchise! everyone treats her as if she were a f%cking Goddess! i hope she dies in the final season.
2.- Christa.
3.- Lilly.
Underrated
1.- Doug.
2.- Sarita.
3.- Mark.
Spoilers ahead!
Underrated:
Carlos(his death was just inaccettable)
Sarah(she could have been a good friend for Clem,but they had very little interactions in my opinion)
Nick(from when his status becomes ''determinant'' he does almost nothing'')
Pete(he deserved much more interactions)
Chuck(he was nice,wise,brave...and we found him dead in a random sewer)
Overrated:
Jane(she had more importance in two episodes than a ton of better characters in a whole season)
I cannot think of anybody else who's really ''overrated''.
*sorry for eventual grammar errors,i'm from neither USA or Britain.
Carver and Bonnie overrated? Did you mean overhated because the general consensus is that they're both dirtbags with disappointing character arcs.
I'm going to assume this was on purpose and move on.
Agreed.
Carver had an arc?!
Agreed on Bonnie though, even if she isn't one of my favorites.
I think the problem is I wasn't looking here, I made an account just a few days ago. For some reason I couldn't find much of her anywhere else.
Ah, well that is odd. Then again, there are so many other, more interesting things to talk about now, so I get it evens out.
I don't know why you bothered listing her since people usually shit on her here.
Because she was ultimately looking out for Clementine's safety just as much as Christa Jr.'s and more or less used herself as a distraction to prevent Victor and "Ralph" from capturing her before she disappeared.
I know. All this complaining, all the story issues that we go through again and again, it takes a toll. How long are we going to keep it up?
But wasn't that line non-optional? Doesn't David tell you this as you two are walking away from her?
in honesty though, despite my lousy joke, the video game series hasn't worn as thin as the comic series. That shit needs to fucking end already. Enough recycling plots and having new ridiculous villains pop up. Just kill Rick, and have his son get with the girl that's been there from the beginning but he's been ignoring.
It's not a slight, it's just that those characters were mostly wasted or inconsistently written.
I was looking at "all that remains" again, and luke's character baffled me. Why did they have Pete be the one to trust her, and Luke be a dick to her when she's bitten?
1. this is a good oppurtunity to set up luke and clem's trusting relationship
2. if you're just going to kill pete off, why have him be the one who trusts her
3. it makes sense, the young emotional dude endangering everyone and the grizzled older man disapproving, but no it's the reverse. Let's not forgot that Nick's mother was also PETE'S SISTER, but that doesn't seem to bother him too much.
4. LITERALLY FIVE MINUTES LATER, LUKE SUDDENLY TRUSTS CLEM. it's almost like they accidentally reversed their roles for that scene.
Seriously, the first half of season 1 is so disjointed and rushed. The second half may feel a bit detached from the first, and have some forced scenes like kenny vs jane, but it does feel more tightly written and focused to me. They also improved the dialogue options a bit.
When you're talking to Nick by Matthew's shack, he freaking goes through mood swings being angry, depressed, and then hopeful in like a minute. I know, that sounds like it's intentional when I write it out, but it in the actual game it feels like a series of lines strung together awkwardly to form a dialogue/scene. It's so jarring.
For one more Season/Installment, apparently.
No, I'm pretty sure he just said he met up with her when it all started and he wouldn't have made it without her(Lee and Clementine, anyone?). Though he commented "The woman is a fuckin soldier," I just assumed it was a compliment, given David is an army guy and all.
Sounds about right, I guess.
You know, I considered the alternate once myself, but I think it makes more sense given that Luke seemed like he was supposed be an up and coming leader and thus him panicking when he sees the bite was supposed to set up that he isn't as confident or maybe even heroic as he tries to be. Plus, Pete is kind of a "good-er" counterpart to Larry, so having him outright mistrust Clementine would kinda mess with that.
You mean Season 2. And yes, yes it does. That's mostly because they were trying to set up some mystery for the later episodes but that fell through when Kenny was recast as a separate character, Breckon left for whatever reason, and Shorette(and the executives) took over.Unfortunately, setting things up can sometimes come at the cost of writing a tighter story, whereas the later episodes had the advantage of wrapping things up, even if it did sloppily in a few cases.
Ya know, that is a fair point. For what it's worth, it felt like it actually made sense with Nick and especially Sarah since they are very emotional characters and the current circumstances helped give them context, but Alvin, on the other hand, was definitely clunky about that.
Not everyone can be Carley or Marianna, dude. People has flaws, visual or otherwise, but are usually good people when it counts.
Off the top of my head
Underrated
Lily - She carried a lot on her shoulders and wasn't afraid to go head-to-head with anyone in the group. Also had a riveting story arc.
Jane - She had a different mentality than the rest of the group and I respected that. Everyone hates her - and S3 events absolutely justify that - but a bad person does not make a bad character.
Overrated
Clementine - She was out of place in S2 due to her being like 9 yet always forced to do adult tasks. In S3 her whole character is consumed by a protect-the-baby trope. Clementine has been written into a corner and she's been riding on the coat tails of S1 for 2 seasons now.
Christa - I always viewed her as a pretty typical character with some slight bossy traits, but noting special. Only when I checked the forums did I see people clamouring for her return. I don't fully get it.
Michonne - Not sure if she's overrated by the fans, but the creators saw fit to give this boring ass character a whole mini-series.
Great. Well, I was thinking that a smaller more self-contained story with Clem looking for AJ would probably present less problems... but who knows at this point.
...weird. But I haven't played through the game more than twice because of the issues, so I don't know if I'm misremembering or not.
I really think it should have ended shortly after Negan was defeated, with an extended epilogue or something.
Yeah, I know, we've discussed that aspect of Luke before. And heck, I still like Pete. But still, something about this whole scene and the following discussion rubs me the wrong way. It feels like a rough draft that needs some rewrites. Luke feels like has very little influence on Clementine, why was he even included in the season 3 recap options? That's a soft retcon.
No doubt, the first half of season 1 is like it's on fast forward. Or sleepwalking through the scenes/going through the motions. It's like they couldn't wait to get rid of the cabin crew.
I have no context, so whatever.
I likely because he was created specifically to interact with Clementine and learn from her, and later became her liaison within the group. Then he was relegated to mostly having a rivalry with Kenny/Carlos due to the strained screentime he got and even that went out the window when they decided to hyperfocus on Jane. Thus, Luke's intended dynamic and importancewas cut short due to being upstaged by those jerkasses and him being listed as an influence is likely both highlighting that he was the next most significant character in Season 2, his different personality and beliefs compared to them, and also acts as a bonus apology to his fans since they got cheated out of what was set up for them.
That may have been the case, unfortunately, given how much importance was given to Kenny and Telltale themselves apparently admitting that they knew writing a story on par with Season 1 would've been extremely difficult.
ANF also felt like that, tbh.
Agreed.
Thank you!
Kenny is one of the most well written characters in the series.
Peeps who say Kenny is overrated are haters. I hate Jane but that doesn't mean she's not a well written antagonist (for me).
Bumping this in part because it's probably the perfect place to ask this redundant question: Why the fuck do you think/feel a lot of people was so sycophantic about Carver?
Tfw you google what sycophantic means but the definition just gives you more words you don’t know so you need to google them too. Probably because he was giving them a home so they knew they wouldn’t get eaten alive and he was the only one there who knew how to run a community
Because he had a cool jacket and badass voice. Who wouldn't follow him?
Someone who knew better and could probably get by just fine.
I meant out of universe.
So nobody introduced in season 2, then?
Ironic you say that considering the plot was supposed to be about getting away from Carver.
So no, almost everyone introduced in Season 2 and then some.
You mean their plan that got everyone killed immediately instead of later? Yeah, it was definitely sensible.
Whatever. It was a lose-lose situation anyway and they did what was almost certainly the better option given the conditions.
No, it was them panicking and thinking that an army of zombies were less scary than people somehow.
Carver's still a man, it's always possible, no matter how slim, that somebody could reason with him, bring him back from the edge of the abyss. They say that he wasn't always that bad, after all. And even then, even if he doesn't change, as long as they didn't fuck up they'd have walls and food to eat. Granted, he really did have it out for Alvin and Reggie, but I'm saying it's not that Black and White. It was like Carver predicted: lambs to the slaughter, so even the writers knew this was the case. You could even make the argument the second half of the season is all about a humiliation/trauma conga line for ungrateful punks that think they know better.
I wholeheartedly agree. Even if Carver was that imminent a danger to them (which I'd argue he really wasn't), there were a million other ways they could've played the scenario, like getting Carver to have a little "accident" and show up dead so Tavia would step in or something. I'd even say that this was something they were setting up! With all the Clem getting close to him and him being so... gullible when it came to her. Should Clem agree with his ideology, whether she means it or not, he's just so quick to believe her, like he was in over his head, already convinced that Clem shared the same world view and methodology... god knows why. This could've culminated into something like Clem quickly earning his trust, becoming his pupil as he seemed to intend... and interesting decisions coming out of such situation.
I'm strongly convinced a Carver ending should've been a thing.
Instead of just sitting on their asses inside the safe and self sustainable community, our group decides to jump into a herd with a man beat to shit, an emotionally weakened woman, a guy who just lost his eye and probably suffered brain damage, two kids, one of which super dependable, and a pregnant woman. Not to mention the long term implications, like, instead of delivering the baby in a safe, stable environment, they'd be having it in the wilderness with no supplies, and even if it made it just think how easy it would be to raise a newborn by the side of the road! It really makes you question if the season 2 cast had any sensibility at all.
Uh, pretty sure that's the whole point of the Walking Dead as a whole, dude..
I don't know, Carver is a such lame villain/character that I honestly find it hard to take the story's word for it when it comes to him. And really, the whole thing ended up feeling almost as pretentious as him. With still more than mile to go, of course.
Show, don't tell. Or in this case, DO tell--EXPLAIN!!!
Which is weird considering his men and a possible rejected apprentice were responsible for that, but whatever.
I still stand by the fact that they were kinda screwed either way with Carver being a thing, not to mention Troy crashing into the loading bay, Luke, Hank, and Bonnie mentioning that the herd was easily the biggest one they ever faced, and the fact that there were several breaches the day before.
Honestly, Carver struck me as the type of guy who thought playing chess a few times and watching Animal Planet made him smart.
Ugh.
Yes he did. He was certainly more engaging as a character than David, at any rate. Carver made no excuses about the kind of man he was. David was a tiresome hypocrite right out the gate.
Technically, I think a hypocrite inherently has at least a little more depth than a one note villain, but whatever.
What I meant was that Carver was more or less the exact same guy from start to finish. Hell, possibly before that with the way the story was written.