Kenny - Clementine forced friendship
I decided to refresh my memory and played first 2 episodes of season 2 and i noticed that Clementine can admit that she doesnt really know Kenny that well (because she doesnt) and that he is a jerk. I know some people decide to play the game from different perspective. Some play it from Clementines pov, some play it from their own, but one thing is for sure, Clementine and Kenny were never good friends in season 1. Right now it feels like some people (certain Kenny fans specifically) just keep Lee - Kenny friendship alive through Clementine, which they had in season 1. For Clementine, Kenny was just a friend of her "father", but the writers try to make them the best buddies right away in season 2 episode 2.
Imo, even the choice between Kenny and Jane wouldnt realistically been that hard for Clementine, considering that she actually just started to get know Kenny (and he was far less likeable than in season 1). I also cant recall any chat between Kenny and Clementine in season 1, so if you know any, feel free to show them.
I cant believe that the writers were just be so imprudent with this forced Kenny - Clementine friendship... At first i thought these first 2 episodes werent so bad after all, but now it just got more depressing, after realizing this...
Comments
It was just as "forced" as the Clem - Jane one too.
Okay.
Cant really see how that was forced in same level as Kenny. Jane didnt even speak to you at first, but eventually she started to talk with you and teach you how to survive on your own, because she saw how fragile the group was. Eventually she started to care about you because little sister drama and she wanted to keep you alive, something she couldnt do with her sister. I must admit, Jane tries to be your friend just as much as Kenny, no matter how mean you are to them. I was more annoyed just at how the game gave option to treat Kenny as your good friend at first sight, even though you didnt actually know him that well.
Yeah I guess, but I just see them both on the same level of forced just so the final decision in episode 5 would be more difficult for us.
I think she got attached because he was a familiar face so long into the apocalypse.
I already said i agreed on that point, it was just the introduction that annoyed the shit out of me. Clem hardly knew Kenny, so there was no point to aim for such emotional "found long lost friend" scenes.
Those scenes at the start were still way over the line.
Clem knew Kenny since the beginning of the ZA, S1EP1, so it is a "long lost friend found" scene
And the Sheriff is right again.
Did you not read anything i just said?
So what you're saying is that all throughout Season 1 Clementine was a really stupid braindead child unaware of her surroundings that never cared about anyone but herself and Lee. You're literally saying that all of her interactions between Clem and Duck and Katjaa play no role in her outlook of Kenny?
"lol I just saw this redneck lose his family in minutes, LOL I WONT SYMPATHIZE WITH HIM EVEN THOUGH DUCK AND KATJAA WERE MY VERY GOOD FRIENDS" - Clem roleplayed by zykelator
You are also forgetting the Kenny that Clem had in mind for 2 years was someone who died heroically trying to save Christa or Ben.
Kenny's and Clem's relationship in Season 2 is completely real and believable.
Clementine not knowing Kenny well is not something you get to decide on behalf of everyone, the choice of saying he's a old friend is just as valid as saying you don't know him that well.
There was three months of events we don't see in season one which are completely up for interpretation. Personally I have no problem imagining that Clementine can have affection for Kenny, even if it only starts off as a reaction to seeing someone familiar, after everyone she used to know had died or disappeared.
And he was thought dead for 2 years, of course Clem would be happy to see him, someone who she did care about to some extent. She did draw the picture of Kenny and his family together, showing she did care for him, even though there were not many scenes with them in Season 1.
Its just their opinion, its ok.
I would argue that, despite us playing as Clem in S2, it's still Clementine being Clementine, and we have to choose the options that she is capable of, not necessarily what we want from her.
Now, from this Kenny situation, we're looking at it from our perspective, but not from Clem's. For us, Kenny may have been a total douche bag, and some of us may end up hating the guy, but let's look at him from Clem's point of view. He is Duck's father, and Katjaa's husband. For Clem, Duck was the only childhood friend around her age group, the only other kid she had to share time with. We know they got along, despite the pranks and name-calling. Katjaa, on the other hand, looked out for Clem when Lee couldn't, acting like a mother-figure in the motor inn. She's there with Clem by the train, as well as in the barn with Maybelle. We know Clem looked up to her, as she waited for Katjaa's permission to pet the cow.
For Clem, Kenny is more than just a familiar face, but a callback to the early days of the apocalypse, before being alone with Christa for the 16 months, before she had to leave Lee. To us, he's just a character in a video game, but for Clem, we should realize that there's a deeper connection between them. So in this regard, it's entirely acceptable for Clem to open up to Kenny against the control and influence of the player.
/Thread
To some degree, yes. Jane's relationship with her is a lot more forced, though. Clementine suddenly growing attached to someone she thought had died two years ago in the most heroic way isn't completely crazy. However, we as Clementine are forced to care about Jane's story of her sister and be caring towards her. The fact that Clem met her less than three days ago doesn't help, either. There's no an option such as "Jane, can we just get to work?". The game forces the idea that Clementine looks up to Jane and deeply cares about her. Soo, you're not completely wrong in thinking it's a bit weird, but you are in saying that Clem's relationship with Jane "wasn't as forced." It was. Only some aspects of Clementine's relationship with Kenny were overblown by Telltale.
[Offer a cigarette]
Eh, I try not to judge, I've never been in a similar situation.
takes
Thank you.
You're welcome, good man.
So you're saying that because she was around Kenny, but never actually actively talked with Kenny, she HAS to like Kenny? Kenny later even wanted to murder/leave behind her friend Ben.
Saving Christa sure was heroic and selfless act from Kenny, probably the best thing he did in the entire game. "Saving" Ben? He went there to check out what happened (lucky that he survived the fall) and killed him out of mercy and then magically survived. (imo, he also seemed a bit suicidal, although i cant see any reason for that). Putting aside all that, Clementine still doesnt know Kenny that well. And tbh, i cant see Christa talking nicely about Kenny, since he wanted to leave Omid behind and what Christa told about how Kenny died is determinant.
OMG, i LOL'ed so much, and not because this is bullshit [it ain't], but because this is just so true and funny. :'D
Even Clementine can admit that she doesnt actually know Kenny that well and say that he is a jerk and if you sat with Luke, he agrees with you.
If i could like that twice, i would.
Well said, dude.
I feel the same way about your reply. (:
Why would the writers put option for Clementine to be honest and say that she doesnt actually know Kenny that well? Every moment we see in the game, they dont talk with each other. Only conversation i can think of is when Kenny wanted to leave Ben behind and Clementine stepped up and defended her friend. This scene is of course determinant, since Clementine can stay at the house.
Jane relationship was forced just as much. Most relationships in Season 2 were if you look at them all. Only ones that developed was the Sarah one, because it showed we could or could not be a good friend to her, and it was totally up to us. Rebecca was mean, then suddenly became nice and cared about us. Alvin was gone before we could really get to know him. Nick was our choice to actually save him or let him die. Luke was kinder to us then anyone next to Pete.
I won't debate any of your points because I have no examples to prove that they are close or were close at the motel. I'm just gonna say that even if Clem and Kenny never directly interacted much in Season 1, they still shared a bond because they were part of the same group that went through the first months of societal collapse. Even if no actual bonding happened, when Kenny and Clem see each other for the first time in 2 years, it shows that they had a bond as being in a that same group once, with the ones they seemingly cared for and loved most.
I don't want to offend anyone who has been through situations like this, but I liken it to soldiers who go into war together, even if they didn't know each other, they shared a bond because they were surviving alongside one another and shared that bond, it's camaraderie in presence of one another.
You are ignoring the fact that in those 16 months she spent Christa, she must have talked shit about Kenny. Kenny wanted to leave Omid behind, so i cant imagine that she was too fond of him. Plus Kenny wanted to leave behind Clementine's friend, Ben. I'd imagine that Christa talked about these with Clementine.
If theres this deeper connection betweem them, why can she admit that he doesnt actually know Kenny that well and say he is a jerk?
This is one thing were player interations should have mattered.
Kenny dying saving Christa was heroic, killing Ben out of mercy wasnt.
Kenny didn't want to let Ben die alone, and he didn't want to let him get eaten alive. What other way was there to put Ben out of his misery?
Poor example, considering that soldiers with against common enemy, while in za, people fight each other and walkers. Kenny wanted to leave behind Ben and i dont think i could be friends with someone after they wanted to let my friend die.
Sacrificing yourself to end someone's suffering is very heroic. Even more if that someone caused your family's death.
You're trying so hard. The desperation is pathetic.
And you're not trying at all. If you dont have anything to add to the conversation, just keep your childish insults to yourself.
Except that he didnt have to "sacrifice" himself...He was going to end Ben's life anyway and he had plenty of time to do that before the walkers reached them. Thats why i said he seemed a bit suicidal.
Still though, the long lost friend scene makes sense since Clem thought he was dead, so that's why she's so surprised to see him.
The only moment CLem speaks to Kenny in series 1 was in ep3, after you get the train going, Clem says to Kenny "duck is sick" and Kenny trying denied everything says "get on the train Clementine." it was something along those lines. But apart from that I did not see Kenny talk to Clem or vies verse. Yes Kenny in some cases if your Lee agrees with him become close friends with Kenny, and because he is he concedes clem as family but it really nothing do with Clem herself. Yeah Kenny story in series 2 was really forced, and just because he was brought back a lot new characters didn't get a moment to shine.
In playthough Lee wasn't friends with Kenny so the fact that Kenny is listening to Clem was just strange with me. Yes I agree we should move on instead of agreeing with Lilly, but I didn't get on Kenny morals of killing Larry, and while I concieder other ends with looking forward to finding supplies in ep4 of series 1 everything just ending badly. So the fact that Kenny is realign himself with Clem doesn't make sense me, I guss tell-tale just pick one option as default and went with it
Anyone could have stayed there three more seconds and put a bullet in the kid's head. However, Kenny showed the kind of man he truly is and tried to get him out of there until there was truly no way out. Instead of going "Oh well, you're done" and point blank shooting him, he got out of there with the freedom to say "I did all I could."
That's debatable, to say the least. Unless you have a formidable argument ready for me explaining how someone who wants to die can escape 30 walkers or so.