Fair enough. He came to asist the Nights Watch because Davos convinced him to, but from this point forward i dont see him personsly fighting the Night's King,
If Stannis actually does anything to help the Battle against the White Walkers, Ill be surprised.
Except he already did. Have you al… moreready forgotten why he's in the North in the first place ? He was the only one to send help to the Wall and personnally come leading his army to save the Night Watch's asses when they were about to be overwhelmed by Mance Rayder's huge army of Wildlings, who would have stormed the Wall and probably left open gates behind them. No Watch = White Walkers able to invade without even having to knock on the door.
Also "unlikeable" certainly, but he knows how to rule and is brave, and that inspires respect in the heart of men, of soldiers. With the shit coming, it's a huge quality much more required than likeability.
And what would Shireen's fate have been if Stannis didn't? Captured by Ramsay and tortured? Freezing to death? Starving to death? Those all sound like much better alternatives, right?
Those obviously were not the only alternatives. She could have been sent back to Castle Black as Davos had suggested. She didn't have to stay put with Stannis and the rest of the army. In any case, the whole idea of "she may not have made it anyway, so burning her alive is no big deal" isn't very fair justification.
You, like many others, are failing to see the big picture
I'm not failing to see the big picture at all. If you're going to be so black and white so as to justify absolutely whatever it takes to ensure the easiest road to victory, then so be it. I don't find any real justification in that line of thought, as I more or less eluded to in my original comment.
And what would Shireen's fate have been if Stannis didn't? Captured by Ramsay and tortured? Freezing to death? Starving to death? Those all … moresound like much better alternatives, right?
You, like many others, are failing to see the big picture and only take things at face value. Saving hundreds of thousands > killing a few. Even more so when you're the last person alive in Westeros with a large army and the only chance to save the continent. If Stannis fails and his men die in the snow, Westeros is left vulnerable to Walkers, Boltons, and anyone else who decides that Westeros is ripe for the taking and everyone is murdered, raped, starve, or freeze to death -- that includes little girls.
This. Plus Stannis doesn't even have a guarantee this works. He's too gullible when it comes to Melisandre's "powers". The shadow baby made an impression on him, okay, but the whole "I can see it in the flames"-thing doesn't really work consistently, neither the ursurpator killing. And why didn't she foresee Ramsay's sabotage, hmmm?
And what would Shireen's fate have been if Stannis didn't? Captured by Ramsay and tortured? Freezing to death? Starving to death? Those all … moresound like much better alternatives, right?
Those obviously were not the only alternatives. She could have been sent back to Castle Black as Davos had suggested. She didn't have to stay put with Stannis and the rest of the army. In any case, the whole idea of "she may not have made it anyway, so burning her alive is no big deal" isn't very fair justification.
You, like many others, are failing to see the big picture
I'm not failing to see the big picture at all. If you're going to be so black and white so as to justify absolutely whatever it takes to ensure the easiest road to victory, then so be it. I don't find any real justification in that line of thought, as I more or less eluded to in my original comment.
Stannis the Mannis
It's the real man, we acknowledge him as the One True King, we bow to his will and show respect also his destiny it's greater than many of us.
I think he was right to believe that Melisande's prediction was correct, considering I don't think she would do such a thing to Stannis without knowing whether it would work or not. That would be pretty risky on her part. Melisandre's assurances aside, it still wasn't the right thing to do.
I actually wonder what sort of impact this horrible thing would realistically have on his army. I don't think it's out of the question that some would think of desertion.
This. Plus Stannis doesn't even have a guarantee this works. He's too gullible when it comes to Melisandre's "powers". The shadow baby made … morean impression on him, okay, but the whole "I can see it in the flames"-thing doesn't really work consistently, neither the ursurpator killing. And why didn't she foresee Ramsay's sabotage, hmmm?
Stannis is a horrible man who burned his daughter alive just to be the king. Is he going to be the best king Westeros has ever seen? Not by … morefar, he would burn anyone who doesn't adhere to Melisandre's religion, just like he did to his brother-in-law. There would be many people who wouldn't support him, and with Davos probably leaving his side, his only advisor Melisandre would probably tell him to burn alive anyone who doesn't support him too.
Daenerys is the best choice for the queen. She is fair, would try to make the differences between the rich and the poor smaller and with her dragons, she's the only hope for the fight against the White Walkers, plus, with advisors like Tyrion, Jorah and Varys, she would do a marvelous job in ruling Westeros. Stannis could be killed by Brienne for all I care about.
You're most right with all, burning his only child alive didn't accomplish nothing more then a plot, the scenes was disturbing and unnecessary, I really rot to his daughter Shireen and I can't pass from this point.
One thing I don't understand is, why is everybody saying that his sacrifice of Shireen was necessary? Necessary for what? I could understand… more what he did, as despicable as it is, if it would guarantee him the throne. However, burning his only child alive guaranteed him nothing, it only gave him a chance to besiege Winterfell, where the Bolton's have their own army. Winterfell is easily the strongest fortress in the North and among the most fortified fortresses in Westeros. Stannis knows exactly how hard it can be to win a siege, as he was able to hold Storm's End for months during Robert's Rebellion against the vastly superior Tyrell army. Of course, Winterfell is not Storm's End, but Roose can probably hold the castle for a similarly long time if he plays his cards right.
On top of that, correct me if I'm wrong, but was it ever stated how many men the Bolton's have? Stannis has 5000-6000 soldiers as far as I know and I guess the Bolton's a… [view original content]
It makes a bit of sense for Sandor to be The Faith's champion and Ser Robert Strong (FrankenGregor) to be Cersei's champion in the books but I have no idea how they'd do it in the show
Yeah especially with Mel around to warn him. If she could just fuck off back to the wall, Brienne only needs an audience with him and Oathkeeper will cut through the lot of them like carving a cake! I think she'll kill Stannis eventually and maybe go down with him
If that happens, I'm done. But it won't, because Brienne will never be able to get close to him or fight him in single combat.
I think the opposite is more likely.
Oh I don't know. Making an offering to her god without knowing whether it will work - just to be on the safe side - does sound like something she would not shy away from. She'll make it appear like every further day Stannis survives will be a result from the offering.
I think he was right to believe that Melisande's prediction was correct, considering I don't think she would do such a thing to Stannis with… moreout knowing whether it would work or not. That would be pretty risky on her part. Melisandre's assurances aside, it still wasn't the right thing to do.
I actually wonder what sort of impact this horrible thing would realistically have on his army. I don't think it's out of the question that some would think of desertion.
'Priest' is being cast to season 6 and his description heavily hints to Meribald or Elder Brother (probably a merge), the role is also said to be a significant one. So, get hype?
It makes a bit of sense for Sandor to be The Faith's champion and Ser Robert Strong (FrankenGregor) to be Cersei's champion in the books but I have no idea how they'd do it in the show
He would probably be representing The Faith, since the Gravedigger Theory is probably true and he'd feel obligated to go from the Quiet Isle to represent them against his brother.
The problem with this theory though, is that he might have given up on that life, and won't want to fight anymore. Also, there's the risk of him losing and then immediately executed by Cersei for abandoning his king.
EDIT: Now that I think about it this is really stupid, since he'll be dead if he loses, excuse me.
It makes a bit of sense for Sandor to be The Faith's champion and Ser Robert Strong (FrankenGregor) to be Cersei's champion in the books but I have no idea how they'd do it in the show
'Priest' is being cast to season 6 and his description heavily hints to Meribald or Elder Brother (probably a merge), the role is also said to be a significant one. So, get hype?
Oh I don't know. Making an offering to her god without knowing whether it will work - just to be on the safe side - does sound like somethin… moreg she would not shy away from. She'll make it appear like every further day Stannis survives will be a result from the offering.
I'm sorry, but Feast of Crows was easily the weakest book for me. A Dance of Dragons I thought was actually pretty great, but Feast was so agonizingly slow. So many plotlines were clearly never going anywhere, Brienne was pointless in the book for a good amount, and then it just ends. Hell I say the Cersei chapters were the best parts, and I hate saying that because I fucking hate Cersei, those were the only parts where the plot advanced. Sansa's chapters were easily the worst bit, they went nowhere for a good amount of time, and just when it starts to head in an interesting direction, done! I for one actually really didn't care for Dorne all that much, hell they are barely in Feast, just a handful of chapters. I never liked Dany's plot past the first book/season, so I hardly feel its the showrunners fault on that. Hell, the best episode of the season was something that wasn't even in the books, that should say something. I admit the series doesn't always make changes for the better, but I think people are a tad bit to hard on these two individuals.
I believe it was a joke. It was childish of them to spoil future books by confirming it was Georges idea. Its normal for fans to complain, t… morehe fans have been criticising the show since the first trailer "Robb's hair is too dark!" "Arya's face is too wide!". IMO the valid criticisms start with Dany's plotline in season 2, and there's plenty to be critical of since. Up until this season its been easier to overlook the occasional misstep because they had so much good material to fall back on. AFFC still had some great chapters up there with the best in the series, Cersei's plotline just doesn't work in season 5 without the context you get from Brienne and Jaime in the riverlands. The Dorne chapters were actually good in Feast but they decided to go their own way changing and merging characters which is fine, but this has been spectacularly bad.
This season was a real test for the D&D having to invent so much of their own material and end u… [view original content]
Okay, here's a thought. If Stannis loses and dies, then how will Davos finding out be relevant in the slightest if he lost? There is nobody left to seek retribution, they will all be dead. So either Stannis wins, and whatever Davos reaction is will probably matter, or they all die and his reaction is utterly pointless. Perhaps that means Stannis wins? Okay i'm just clutching straws, but still, maybe.
Now THIS is the fight that its worth 90 dollars! It doesn't matter what you think of Stannis for the moment, we all need to pray that he wi… morens this fight, after that, well that's up to you, but for now we need to see this stone cold fucker put in the ground one piece at a time. For Robb Stark! The King of the North! May his memory be avenged this coming Sunday!
I think I'm still on Stannis' side, but only because of lack of other options.
Dany - Hell no. I'm sorry, but she just isn't the brightes… moret. She thinks even now that she can keep the slaver's bay thing up, but everyone knows it will go back to the way it was as soon as she leaves, and next time they will be more prepared. She just doesn't get it. I think she's way too idealistic to be a good Queen.
Tommen - Too easily manipulated and useless without his mother or wife.
I actually don't remember if there are more claims, but I'd still take Stannis over them because I understand why he thought he must do it, but damn, that's just cold (pls no fire puns).
I still support Stannis, but he isn't the Mannis anymore. Just the smallest evil.
Ugh but with Ramsay dead where do we get another psycho? We lost Joffers. Don't get me wrong I want him dead, but he's my favourite villain, and a bloody good one.
I should reconsider my position, the white walker are the best bet. Plus they have best claim to the throne they've been around longer then any of hose families.
Can anyone explain to me why they had to burn Shireen anyway. The leaches with Gendry's blood killed Joffer's. Is that not the same logic they could have used here.
If some bastard blood can kill a king surely they could have told Shireen that they needed blood and just cut her hand. Her's is worth more then Gendry's right? Surely that would have helped hem.
Hell, with this logic Stannis could have just cut his hand and killed all his enemies.
I do agree I hate him win a burning passion now, and I want that witch burnt at the stake, and hear her screams.
My opinion might be very unpopular in here, but I deeply despise Stannis for what he have done. This decision was absolutely unneccessary, u… morenlogical and cruel. I simply don't know the purpose of this sacrifice.
Firstly, I can't understand Stannis' logic. He kept playing the role of the best father ever. He was kind to Shireen and proved that he loves her. Melisandre offered to burn his daughter and he refused immediately. And then Stannis just suddenly changes his mind, forgets about everything he did and decides to burn the innocent child. Wow, really? Then what was the point of all this "father of the year" bullshit? Besides, Shireen is his only heir and we don't know if he'll ever have another one. It looks like he thinks only about getting on the throne. But the future doesn't interest him. Who's going to be his heir now?
Secondly, I can't understand people who say that Stannis had no other choice. If he wants to be a good king, he … [view original content]
I should reconsider my position, the white walker are the best bet. Plus they have best claim to the throne they've been around longer then any of hose families.
Comments
Cool, I already love this guy's channel
Thank you for showing me this ^-^
Fair enough. He came to asist the Nights Watch because Davos convinced him to, but from this point forward i dont see him personsly fighting the Night's King,
Those obviously were not the only alternatives. She could have been sent back to Castle Black as Davos had suggested. She didn't have to stay put with Stannis and the rest of the army. In any case, the whole idea of "she may not have made it anyway, so burning her alive is no big deal" isn't very fair justification.
I'm not failing to see the big picture at all. If you're going to be so black and white so as to justify absolutely whatever it takes to ensure the easiest road to victory, then so be it. I don't find any real justification in that line of thought, as I more or less eluded to in my original comment.
This. Plus Stannis doesn't even have a guarantee this works. He's too gullible when it comes to Melisandre's "powers". The shadow baby made an impression on him, okay, but the whole "I can see it in the flames"-thing doesn't really work consistently, neither the ursurpator killing. And why didn't she foresee Ramsay's sabotage, hmmm?
Stannis the Mannis
It's the real man, we acknowledge him as the One True King, we bow to his will and show respect also his destiny it's greater than many of us.
His destiny to be slain by the maid of Tarth, Brienne the beauty next episode and ending the Baratheon line!
If Brienne kills another of my favourite characters...
Cleganebowl confirmed though
If that happens, I'm done. But it won't, because Brienne will never be able to get close to him or fight him in single combat.
I think the opposite is more likely.
I think he was right to believe that Melisande's prediction was correct, considering I don't think she would do such a thing to Stannis without knowing whether it would work or not. That would be pretty risky on her part. Melisandre's assurances aside, it still wasn't the right thing to do.
I actually wonder what sort of impact this horrible thing would realistically have on his army. I don't think it's out of the question that some would think of desertion.
If he die, he will go to hell and become....
Stannis the Satannis!
ahh I just wanted to post this
I'm hoping Davos at least gets to throw a punch, if not kill Stannis himself.
You're most right with all, burning his only child alive didn't accomplish nothing more then a plot, the scenes was disturbing and unnecessary, I really rot to his daughter Shireen and I can't pass from this point.
Cleganebowl must happen. RR pls.
It makes a bit of sense for Sandor to be The Faith's champion and Ser Robert Strong (FrankenGregor) to be Cersei's champion in the books but I have no idea how they'd do it in the show
Yeah especially with Mel around to warn him. If she could just fuck off back to the wall, Brienne only needs an audience with him and Oathkeeper will cut through the lot of them like carving a cake! I think she'll kill Stannis eventually and maybe go down with him
Oh I don't know. Making an offering to her god without knowing whether it will work - just to be on the safe side - does sound like something she would not shy away from. She'll make it appear like every further day Stannis survives will be a result from the offering.
'Priest' is being cast to season 6 and his description heavily hints to Meribald or Elder Brother (probably a merge), the role is also said to be a significant one. So, get hype?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psS2IMFkxKo
He would probably be representing The Faith, since the Gravedigger Theory is probably true and he'd feel obligated to go from the Quiet Isle to represent them against his brother.
The problem with this theory though, is that he might have given up on that life, and won't want to fight anymore. Also, there's the risk of him losing and then immediately executed by Cersei for abandoning his king.
EDIT: Now that I think about it this is really stupid, since he'll be dead if he loses, excuse me.
I'll be fully hyped when the Kingsmoot happens... But Cleganebowl is a good start
LMFAO
Gravedigger is real!
Fuck it I have a New King :
Yes, just like she makes it seem like Robb and Joffrey's deaths were her doing when we know how those came about.
I'm sorry, but Feast of Crows was easily the weakest book for me. A Dance of Dragons I thought was actually pretty great, but Feast was so agonizingly slow. So many plotlines were clearly never going anywhere, Brienne was pointless in the book for a good amount, and then it just ends. Hell I say the Cersei chapters were the best parts, and I hate saying that because I fucking hate Cersei, those were the only parts where the plot advanced. Sansa's chapters were easily the worst bit, they went nowhere for a good amount of time, and just when it starts to head in an interesting direction, done! I for one actually really didn't care for Dorne all that much, hell they are barely in Feast, just a handful of chapters. I never liked Dany's plot past the first book/season, so I hardly feel its the showrunners fault on that. Hell, the best episode of the season was something that wasn't even in the books, that should say something. I admit the series doesn't always make changes for the better, but I think people are a tad bit to hard on these two individuals.
Okay, here's a thought. If Stannis loses and dies, then how will Davos finding out be relevant in the slightest if he lost? There is nobody left to seek retribution, they will all be dead. So either Stannis wins, and whatever Davos reaction is will probably matter, or they all die and his reaction is utterly pointless. Perhaps that means Stannis wins? Okay i'm just clutching straws, but still, maybe.
I also don't think that he's Azor Ahai.
Okay, I have a question. How do you think Davos will react when he finds out that Stannis burned Shireen?
Stannis will get revenge for Shireen?
Dunno how, he killed her.
Yeah the choices aren't that good are they?
I'm siding with Tyrion (which unfortunately means Dany), sure he won't get the throne but if he could he'd be my pick.
I really hope Dany starts listening to her advisors but that probably won't happen
That would be great, I think he'd deserve it too. Not just for Shireen but for being gullible as well.
Ugh but with Ramsay dead where do we get another psycho? We lost Joffers. Don't get me wrong I want him dead, but he's my favourite villain, and a bloody good one.
I should reconsider my position, the white walker are the best bet. Plus they have best claim to the throne they've been around longer then any of hose families.
Can anyone explain to me why they had to burn Shireen anyway. The leaches with Gendry's blood killed Joffer's. Is that not the same logic they could have used here.
If some bastard blood can kill a king surely they could have told Shireen that they needed blood and just cut her hand. Her's is worth more then Gendry's right? Surely that would have helped hem.
Hell, with this logic Stannis could have just cut his hand and killed all his enemies.
I do agree I hate him win a burning passion now, and I want that witch burnt at the stake, and hear her screams.
ALL HEIL THE ONE TRUE KING
I'm starting to worry maybe he won't do anything at all but be upset, but I reckon he will kill the witch. Maybe not now, but eventually.
WHITEWALKERSFORTHEIRONTHRONE