I'll tell you what's terrifying. When mere mortals start believing that they have the right to decide who should live and who should die. The Walking Dead is a world without laws so I believe that it's more important than ever to have a moral code and not just kill everyone that gets in my way. It's all just my opinion but I'm convinced that I did the right thing.
The moment a person points a gun at a child, that person needs to be put down for good. It's terrifying that you would allow such a monster … moreto live AND stay with your group. You wouldn't survive long in an apocalypse when you keep garbage people around and show mercy where it is not deserved.
I'll tell you what's terrifying. When mere mortals start believing that they have the right to decide who should live and who should die. Th… moree Walking Dead is a world without laws so I believe that it's more important than ever to have a moral code and not just kill everyone that gets in my way. It's all just my opinion but I'm convinced that I did the right thing.
I understand your complant against clem inconsisteny when the teat gas occurs
but u have to understand its 2 different realties after you make a choice-therefore its fine
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your logic, we aren't even allowed to put evil people into prisons. I mean, who gives us the right to decide who is allowed to roam freely and who isn't? If only "god" was the judge, then everyone could do what they want in "this" life. Rape people, enslave them, rob and kill them. Why don't we let ISIS do whatever they want then?
I'll tell you what's terrifying. When mere mortals start believing that they have the right to decide who should live and who should die. Th… moree Walking Dead is a world without laws so I believe that it's more important than ever to have a moral code and not just kill everyone that gets in my way. It's all just my opinion but I'm convinced that I did the right thing.
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I… more won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your… [view original content]
I like Gabe, and I think he has potential for development, which could help the God-forsaken story that is season 3, although I don't like Gabentine, I lowkey hope he survives. (Still make funny gabe-hate jokes though.)
I just wish that the community didn't hate on Gabe support so much. He seems realistic (even that he's a pussy in the zombie apocalypse because he was protected by Javi most of the time) and I think it's time Clem has a friend (JUST A FRIEND) her own age.
It wasn't my intention to bring religion into this, all I meant was that we shouldn't go around killing people because of what they've done or might do. The only justifieable reason in my opinion to take a life is in self defense, when there's no other choice.
That's all just my opinion, in no way was it my intention to belittle yours, so don't start harassing me because you disagree with my beliefs. This discussion is going nowhere so I'm ending it here. I come here to discuss what I love and to speculate with my fellow fans not to be bullied by some entitled prick on the internet who can't get behind the concept of agreeing to disagree. You may continue to harass or insult me but you'll be wasting your time, I'm done with this bullshit and won't be replying to your harassment any longer.
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I… more won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your… [view original content]
The moment a person points a gun at a child, that person needs to be put down for good. It's terrifying that you would allow such a monster … moreto live AND stay with your group. You wouldn't survive long in an apocalypse when you keep garbage people around and show mercy where it is not deserved.
Chill the fuck out, not like I insulted your mother and ran over your dog. And I'm saying that shooting him is really fucking dumb because there is a big chance that he takes at least one person with him if Javier misses the first shot or Conrad clenches his fingers when he dies, which, realistically, probably would happen. Then Gabe ends up with a bullet in his head all the same.
I also don't believe that you actually read all of my comment, because I recall saying
Conrad is in the wrong, obviously, but it was still risky as hell to shoot him
Which means that keeping Conrad around isn't necessarily the better choice, but shooting him is the worse one because it could backfire really bad, really quick, and not shooting him is equal to keeping him around. A package deal. It's all moot anyway because Conrad did a 180° in the next episode.
Gabe has been helpful for the group sometimes (like someone said before). I dont hate him because I dont have any reason to do that. He is far from being my favourite character, but I dont want him to die.
Agreeing to disagree when you want to justify putting everyone's life at risk just for the sake of protecting a single criminal? Go flee all you want. Escape the discussion and continue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit.
My question to you was: Who do you think gives us the right to put people in a prison cell for what they did? Why do we even fight evil? Who gives us the right?
It wasn't my intention to bring religion into this, all I meant was that we shouldn't go around killing people because of what they've done … moreor might do. The only justifieable reason in my opinion to take a life is in self defense, when there's no other choice.
That's all just my opinion, in no way was it my intention to belittle yours, so don't start harassing me because you disagree with my beliefs. This discussion is going nowhere so I'm ending it here. I come here to discuss what I love and to speculate with my fellow fans not to be bullied by some entitled prick on the internet who can't get behind the concept of agreeing to disagree. You may continue to harass or insult me but you'll be wasting your time, I'm done with this bullshit and won't be replying to your harassment any longer.
Unfortunately, it seems that way. Then again, I'm not one to overreact to mistakes and poor judgement anyway, so it's not like it makes that big a difference. As long as they don't decide to kill someone for no good reason (again), they're good.
Probably one of the biggest causes I think (and should be the most obvious) of both Gabe's and Clementine's somewhat sometimes irrational be… morehavior is puberty, as teens do have mood swings which affect their ability to think rationally and cause them to act out, as seen in Gabe, sometimes in Clementine. But another cause as said by NRGphuck is just poor writing on behalf of Gabe, but even so, it isn't a reason to hate Gabe, it's a reason to dislike telltale for not giving enough attention to the characters actions.
dont hate the character, hate the writer
Again, my main point was how dangerous it was to even think about taking a shot at Conrad under the circumstances they were in, and how easy everything could have gone to shit from there on. It doesn't mean I condone Conrad's actions. Sure, it is a videogame in the end and headshots never miss and always take out the opponent directly, but Javier could easily have missed or caused Conrad to shoot Gabe accidentally, let alone accidentally hit Gabe, if there was any realism in this scenario. Maybe I shouldn't judge this game by real standards.
In that moment, he put a gun on a child, told Javi to give up another child to a group we had just watched destroy a town.
A group that Clementine was a part of previously, and that she could still be a part of for all they know. Unlikely and a stupid idea if you think about it more, but I don't think any of them were thinking clearly when they just lost Prescott and were chased by a ton of walkers. Call it cold (and it certainly is), but Conrad's plan made sense, even if he was tripping balls and was way out of line in threatening anyone, let alone put a gun at a kid's head. I'm not justifying Conrad's actions, I'm saying that taking a shot at Conrad was really rash and could have ended much worse.
People who can do that sort of thing, have no excuse for their actions.
In reality, no. But in a fictional story, redemption arcs like this are not even not unheard of, but are very common. Of course it comes all back to the writing. It's a very unrealisic character arc, but I expected them to do something better with Conrad than they did in Episode 1.2, and ultimately they did. Also, this is a Telltale game still. It's not like anything would have happened to Clementine anyway. I know, maybe kind of hypocritical to now judge it by fictional values when I judged the shooting scenario so realistically, but it's what went through my head at the time.
As for Clem and Javi not really knowing each other. Clem could have left without ever saying a word about being with the new frontier, but she behaved in a stand up way, said she ran with them but didn't anymore. That would be enough to earn some trust or at least not be handed over to a group of thugs for my own benefit.
But in the TWD universe, it ultimately always comes down to you or them. While I can see your point about Clementine being forthcoming, it still doesn't mean that Conrad's plan wasn't, all in all, a good plan, even if very cold. Also, don't mistake this for choosing Conrad over Clementine, it's just more sensible not to take a potshot at a guy in closed quarters while he has a gun on a kid and to turn Clementine in to gain The New Frontier's trust. It's a shitty thing to do, but all of the survivors at this point have done much worse, else they wouldn't be alive anymore in the first place.
Conrad is a potential child killing piece of shit and you decided to let him live.
I didn't. Shot him right in the face the first time around. But it was an impulsive decision, and it doesn't mean you can't go back to that choice later and evaluate it. It was a shitty situation that could have easily ended a lot shittier, with two or more people dead instead of just Conrad.
The man held a child at gun point. Anyone who can do that is a very bad person, just cause Telltale decided to make him not an insane in lat… moreer episodes just makes them really bad a drawing a characters. In that moment, he put a gun on a child, told Javi to give up another child to a group we had just watched destroy a town. In my mind, even if he could be talked down, there was every chance he would do something similar again, and maybe this time I would not be able to stop him. So he died because that's what had to be done. People who can do that sort of thing, have no excuse for their actions.
As for Clem and Javi not really knowing each other. Clem could have left without ever saying a word about being with the new frontier, but she behaved in a stand up way, said she ran with them but didn't anymore. That would be enough to earn some trust or at least not be handed over to a group of thugs for my own benefit. You can excuse your action… [view original content]
can bear with his angst but that, that was just plain stupid and I wish it could have been determinant depending on how you treat him throughout the episode, it would have made more sense and toned down the Gabe hate a little.
I aknowledge that Gabe is well-written as the teen he is but that doesn't stop me from having a little resentment when he rats me out, effec… moretively destroying the group when we need it the most. I can bear with his angst but that, that was just plain stupid and I wish it could have been determinant depending on how you treat him throughout the episode, it would have made more sense and toned down the Gabe hate a little.
Chill the fuck out, not like I insulted your mother and ran over your dog. And I'm saying that shooting him is really fucking dumb because t… morehere is a big chance that he takes at least one person with him if Javier misses the first shot or Conrad clenches his fingers when he dies, which, realistically, probably would happen. Then Gabe ends up with a bullet in his head all the same.
I also don't believe that you actually read all of my comment, because I recall saying
Conrad is in the wrong, obviously, but it was still risky as hell to shoot him
Which means that keeping Conrad around isn't necessarily the better choice, but shooting him is the worse one because it could backfire really bad, really quick, and not shooting him is equal to keeping him around. A package deal. It's all moot anyway because Conrad did a 180° in the next episode.
Still don't see how insulting me was necessary, but we'll agree to disagree. Conrad turns around entirely the very next episode. Doesn't matter if it's shitty writing, it still happened.
I agree with one point : don't join any bandwagons because of what other people think. View, and form your own opinion. Once you have your o… morewn opinion, feel free to share it with others, but realize that not everyone is going to share that opinion. Learn to discuss a difference of opinion without blame, shame, or patronizing how they view things. This is possibly the most difficult lesson in life to learn, so difficult it has divided nations and even caused wars.
Characters every season have fans with strong loyalties. If you don't think Gabe has any redeemable qualities, and you can't stand him :: That's okay. He's not a real person, and you feel how you feel. If you like Gabe, and can't wait to see how he develops in the next episode :: That's okay. He's relatable to you, and you feel how you feel.
I am not a mod but I will say that you are very rude which you should think about.
"Go flee all you want. Escape the discussion and continue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit."
AgentZ46 already have explained that his/her's intention was to defuse the situation and talk Conrad out of it later when he had calmed down instead of dealing with consequences of a dead man which could make Tripp finding out and start fighting Javier, Gabe and Clem and increase lost lives (may be Javier, Clem or/and Gabe) which could be solved by AgentZ46 way which I dare to say is better than the other option. Yes I wrote it. His latest reply to me explained why and therefor I agree with AgentZ46 and defend it because AgentZ46 correct. I was wrong from the beginning.
Agreeing to disagree when you want to justify putting everyone's life at risk just for the sake of protecting a single criminal? Go flee all… more you want. Escape the discussion and continue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit.
My question to you was: Who do you think gives us the right to put people in a prison cell for what they did? Why do we even fight evil? Who gives us the right?
Nobody tells me what to do. I stay on the Dark Side, they have cookies here.
In all seriousness, I just don't find Gabe likable. You can justify his behavior all you want and it may make him sympathetic and he may be just a scared kid living in a zombie apocalypse. That doesn't change the fact that I don't feel any emotional attachment to him or there hasn't been a moment where I really bond with him. It is perfectly fine that you like him, but that doesn't mean you have to change other people's opinion on him.
Still don't see how insulting me was necessary, but we'll agree to disagree. Conrad turns around entirely the very next episode. Doesn't matter if it's shitty writing, it still happened.
Sure, it is a videogame in the end and headshots never miss and always take out the opponent directly, but Javier could easily have missed or caused Conrad to shoot Gabe accidentally, let alone accidentally hit Gabe, if there was any realism in this scenario. Maybe I shouldn't judge this game by real standards.
Personally I do play the game as if this were real life or how would I react if this was me. I take these scenarios, as just that a scenario, a "what do I think about this". My instinct in the moment would be to not take the shot, defuse the situation and get the gun off of my nephew and then kill Conrad the moment he let his guard down. But I knew I would not ever get another chance to get rid of him before we turned over Clem and I knew damn well it would work out if I did take the the shot. So I took the shot, I got rid of they guy who was threatening people's lives on a "maybe" scenario.
Call it cold (and it certainly is), but Conrad's plan made sense
That plan never made sense. There was no indication from these people what so ever that they would even want Clem, that they were looking for her, that they had some sort of beef with her, that there was a bounty on her. Nothing. Conrad just decided it would work out of the clear blue sky and suddenly I had to get in line or my nephew would die. It was insane from the word go to even consider turning over someone to these people in the hopes that they would forget about the members of their group we had killed.
and remember this, Conrad was willing to kill a child (yes a thirteen year old is still a child, sorry to all you teens reading this if you disagree). Was he having a bad day, was he emotionally distraught, did he not think this through at all? Yes to all of that, but child killing is something that this man is capable of. That's a part of him, its not going anywhere, there are no second acts in our lives, the things we do or are capable of, are things we will always be capable of or could always be able to do under the right circumstances. The past is real and we carry it with us. So the next time Conrad has a bad day, whose gonna pay? We cant get him mental help, we can't imprison him, we either let him live and wait for the next bad day, or we take care of the problem.
Again, my main point was how dangerous it was to even think about taking a shot at Conrad under the circumstances they were in, and how easy… more everything could have gone to shit from there on. It doesn't mean I condone Conrad's actions. Sure, it is a videogame in the end and headshots never miss and always take out the opponent directly, but Javier could easily have missed or caused Conrad to shoot Gabe accidentally, let alone accidentally hit Gabe, if there was any realism in this scenario. Maybe I shouldn't judge this game by real standards.
In that moment, he put a gun on a child, told Javi to give up another child to a group we had just watched destroy a town.
A group that Clementine was a part of previously, and that she could still be a part of for all they know. Unlikely and a stupid idea if you think about it more, but I don't think any of them were thinking clearly when they just lost Prescott and were chased by a ton of … [view original content]
Sarah wasn't on the same level mentally as the others, Duck was younger than Sarah and never went out of his way to sabotage the group or make matters worse. Neither of these characters were put in a position to contribute to the group, so it's kinda unfair to make any comparisons to Gabe.
Most accurate comparison would be Ben imo. Both were able-bodied people who were at one point tasked with directly helping the group at least once during their seasons. Both made snap decisions on their own that hurt the rest of the group. Only difference I see right now is Ben showed remorse for his mistake, Gabe is so full of himself that he'd do it again in a heartbeat if he thought Clem would be impressed.
I agree with one point : don't join any bandwagons because of what other people think. View, and form your own opinion. Once you have your o… morewn opinion, feel free to share it with others, but realize that not everyone is going to share that opinion. Learn to discuss a difference of opinion without blame, shame, or patronizing how they view things. This is possibly the most difficult lesson in life to learn, so difficult it has divided nations and even caused wars.
Characters every season have fans with strong loyalties. If you don't think Gabe has any redeemable qualities, and you can't stand him :: That's okay. He's not a real person, and you feel how you feel. If you like Gabe, and can't wait to see how he develops in the next episode :: That's okay. He's relatable to you, and you feel how you feel.
Oh come on man, Gabe is so poorly written just like most of the season is. It's not a coincidence that most people dislike him, he's just no… moret likeable. Your opinion is your own, but you probably shouldn't call everyone else's negative opinion of him unjustified or exaggerated.
Anti-Gabe train full speed ahead
Domi_nique said:
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I won't take you serious anymore.
[...]
You realize how fucked up your morals are?
Fellas, fellas, fellas, let's calm down and tone it down a notch please. It's starting to teeter towards insults and there's no need for that.
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I… more won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your… [view original content]
LeeClemKen said:
You're saying that keeping a guy capable of killing a kid in the group is the better choice? You're fucked up.
EpicMustacheGuy said:
Chill the fuck out, not like I insulted your mother and ran over your dog.
Guys, chillll, please. Let's try and debate in a more civil manner instead of retorting with personal attacks and/or rude retorts. Take a breather and relax.
Just a friendly reminder, please tone it down a notch with personal attacks and rude comments. I've noticed a few comments in this thread are getting a bit heavy handed in regards to people being rude. Let's try to keep comments and debate civil, please. Thanks!
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I… more won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your… [view original content]
Interestingly enough, here is what happens if you do nothing when asked to shoot Conrad/Accept the plan (skip to 7:36 if the video starts from the beginning):
I am not a mod but I will say that you are very rude which you should think about.
"Go flee all you want. Escape the discussion and cont… moreinue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit."
AgentZ46 already have explained that his/her's intention was to defuse the situation and talk Conrad out of it later when he had calmed down instead of dealing with consequences of a dead man which could make Tripp finding out and start fighting Javier, Gabe and Clem and increase lost lives (may be Javier, Clem or/and Gabe) which could be solved by AgentZ46 way which I dare to say is better than the other option. Yes I wrote it. His latest reply to me explained why and therefor I agree with AgentZ46 and defend it because AgentZ46 correct. I was wrong from the beginning.
Interestingly enough, here is what happens if you do nothing when asked to shoot Conrad/Accept the plan (skip to 7:36 if the video starts from the beginning):
I don't have a problem justifying his screw ups on being a teen. I know I made the statement that he was worse than Sarah, Ben and Nick combined in an earlier thread but honestly I like all three of those characters. their mistakes and struggle to cope made them feel real, and before episode 4 I thought Gabe was alright too despite his shortcomings.
What I cannot forgive is Gabe being a total snitch because of something as petty as being treated like a little kid who doesn't know how to survive, which he is. Neither Ben nor Sarah tried to pretend to be useful when they weren't. All it does is make Gabe look like a brat on top of being incompetent.
Comments
I will hate him if he keep fucking up you can't make me dad
I'll tell you what's terrifying. When mere mortals start believing that they have the right to decide who should live and who should die. The Walking Dead is a world without laws so I believe that it's more important than ever to have a moral code and not just kill everyone that gets in my way. It's all just my opinion but I'm convinced that I did the right thing.
My moral code says that someone who points a gun at a kid doesn't deserve to live. Especially if that kid is my nephew.
I understand your complant against clem inconsisteny when the teat gas occurs
but u have to understand its 2 different realties after you make a choice-therefore its fine
Well you have the right to think so. Doesn't change how I feel.
same
Mortals? You talk as if there was a higher being. Continue to believe in your fucked up, naive "morals" and imaginary wizard all you want. I won't take you serious anymore.
People need to make decisions for themselves. There is no god that will punish the evil people. We have to do it ourselves. And yes, we do have the right to decide who is allowed to live and who isn't. Those who don't respect the life of innocents loose their own right to be respected. You are a good person? Fine, no need to fear death or other consequences.
But the moment you become evil, like by pointing a fucking gun on an innocent child in order to grab power and sell out another innocent child.. you should fear the consequences. There is no reason to keep garbage people alive, especially in a world like TWD.
You exactly point out what's wrong with this world. The criminals gets better treatment and more protection than the victims, sad world.
EDIT: By your logic, we aren't even allowed to put evil people into prisons. I mean, who gives us the right to decide who is allowed to roam freely and who isn't? If only "god" was the judge, then everyone could do what they want in "this" life. Rape people, enslave them, rob and kill them. Why don't we let ISIS do whatever they want then?
You realize how fucked up your morals are?
indeed
I like Gabe, and I think he has potential for development, which could help the God-forsaken story that is season 3, although I don't like Gabentine, I lowkey hope he survives. (Still make funny gabe-hate jokes though.)
I just wish that the community didn't hate on Gabe support so much. He seems realistic (even that he's a pussy in the zombie apocalypse because he was protected by Javi most of the time) and I think it's time Clem has a friend (JUST A FRIEND) her own age.
Gabe's very unlikable because he keeps saying that people should stop treating him like a kid, but it's him, himself who should stop acting like one.
He's flat out annoying, and obnoxious. I hope he fucking dies along with that shitty ship called "Gabentine".
It wasn't my intention to bring religion into this, all I meant was that we shouldn't go around killing people because of what they've done or might do. The only justifieable reason in my opinion to take a life is in self defense, when there's no other choice.
That's all just my opinion, in no way was it my intention to belittle yours, so don't start harassing me because you disagree with my beliefs. This discussion is going nowhere so I'm ending it here. I come here to discuss what I love and to speculate with my fellow fans not to be bullied by some entitled prick on the internet who can't get behind the concept of agreeing to disagree. You may continue to harass or insult me but you'll be wasting your time, I'm done with this bullshit and won't be replying to your harassment any longer.
Welp. I guess I should have killed Kenny instead of going to Wellington as teens count as kids in the eyes of the law
Chill the fuck out, not like I insulted your mother and ran over your dog. And I'm saying that shooting him is really fucking dumb because there is a big chance that he takes at least one person with him if Javier misses the first shot or Conrad clenches his fingers when he dies, which, realistically, probably would happen. Then Gabe ends up with a bullet in his head all the same.
I also don't believe that you actually read all of my comment, because I recall saying
Which means that keeping Conrad around isn't necessarily the better choice, but shooting him is the worse one because it could backfire really bad, really quick, and not shooting him is equal to keeping him around. A package deal. It's all moot anyway because Conrad did a 180° in the next episode.
Gabe has been helpful for the group sometimes (like someone said before). I dont hate him because I dont have any reason to do that. He is far from being my favourite character, but I dont want him to die.
Why?
Agreeing to disagree when you want to justify putting everyone's life at risk just for the sake of protecting a single criminal? Go flee all you want. Escape the discussion and continue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit.
My question to you was: Who do you think gives us the right to put people in a prison cell for what they did? Why do we even fight evil? Who gives us the right?
Unfortunately, it seems that way. Then again, I'm not one to overreact to mistakes and poor judgement anyway, so it's not like it makes that big a difference. As long as they don't decide to kill someone for no good reason (again), they're good.
I'd rather try not to hate at all, thank you.
Again, my main point was how dangerous it was to even think about taking a shot at Conrad under the circumstances they were in, and how easy everything could have gone to shit from there on. It doesn't mean I condone Conrad's actions. Sure, it is a videogame in the end and headshots never miss and always take out the opponent directly, but Javier could easily have missed or caused Conrad to shoot Gabe accidentally, let alone accidentally hit Gabe, if there was any realism in this scenario. Maybe I shouldn't judge this game by real standards.
A group that Clementine was a part of previously, and that she could still be a part of for all they know. Unlikely and a stupid idea if you think about it more, but I don't think any of them were thinking clearly when they just lost Prescott and were chased by a ton of walkers. Call it cold (and it certainly is), but Conrad's plan made sense, even if he was tripping balls and was way out of line in threatening anyone, let alone put a gun at a kid's head. I'm not justifying Conrad's actions, I'm saying that taking a shot at Conrad was really rash and could have ended much worse.
In reality, no. But in a fictional story, redemption arcs like this are not even not unheard of, but are very common. Of course it comes all back to the writing. It's a very unrealisic character arc, but I expected them to do something better with Conrad than they did in Episode 1.2, and ultimately they did. Also, this is a Telltale game still. It's not like anything would have happened to Clementine anyway. I know, maybe kind of hypocritical to now judge it by fictional values when I judged the shooting scenario so realistically, but it's what went through my head at the time.
But in the TWD universe, it ultimately always comes down to you or them. While I can see your point about Clementine being forthcoming, it still doesn't mean that Conrad's plan wasn't, all in all, a good plan, even if very cold. Also, don't mistake this for choosing Conrad over Clementine, it's just more sensible not to take a potshot at a guy in closed quarters while he has a gun on a kid and to turn Clementine in to gain The New Frontier's trust. It's a shitty thing to do, but all of the survivors at this point have done much worse, else they wouldn't be alive anymore in the first place.
I didn't. Shot him right in the face the first time around. But it was an impulsive decision, and it doesn't mean you can't go back to that choice later and evaluate it. It was a shitty situation that could have easily ended a lot shittier, with two or more people dead instead of just Conrad.
Agreed
Javier didn't miss, Gabe didn't die and one less asshole is alive so this is the better choice.
Still don't see how insulting me was necessary, but we'll agree to disagree. Conrad turns around entirely the very next episode. Doesn't matter if it's shitty writing, it still happened.
Too late
I am not a mod but I will say that you are very rude which you should think about.
"Go flee all you want. Escape the discussion and continue to dodge unpleasant questions. But I won't stop pointing out the obvious bullshit."
AgentZ46 already have explained that his/her's intention was to defuse the situation and talk Conrad out of it later when he had calmed down instead of dealing with consequences of a dead man which could make Tripp finding out and start fighting Javier, Gabe and Clem and increase lost lives (may be Javier, Clem or/and Gabe) which could be solved by AgentZ46 way which I dare to say is better than the other option. Yes I wrote it. His latest reply to me explained why and therefor I agree with AgentZ46 and defend it because AgentZ46 correct. I was wrong from the beginning.
Nobody tells me what to do. I stay on the Dark Side, they have cookies here.
In all seriousness, I just don't find Gabe likable. You can justify his behavior all you want and it may make him sympathetic and he may be just a scared kid living in a zombie apocalypse. That doesn't change the fact that I don't feel any emotional attachment to him or there hasn't been a moment where I really bond with him. It is perfectly fine that you like him, but that doesn't mean you have to change other people's opinion on him.
I didn't insult you in any way.
Personally I do play the game as if this were real life or how would I react if this was me. I take these scenarios, as just that a scenario, a "what do I think about this". My instinct in the moment would be to not take the shot, defuse the situation and get the gun off of my nephew and then kill Conrad the moment he let his guard down. But I knew I would not ever get another chance to get rid of him before we turned over Clem and I knew damn well it would work out if I did take the the shot. So I took the shot, I got rid of they guy who was threatening people's lives on a "maybe" scenario.
That plan never made sense. There was no indication from these people what so ever that they would even want Clem, that they were looking for her, that they had some sort of beef with her, that there was a bounty on her. Nothing. Conrad just decided it would work out of the clear blue sky and suddenly I had to get in line or my nephew would die. It was insane from the word go to even consider turning over someone to these people in the hopes that they would forget about the members of their group we had killed.
and remember this, Conrad was willing to kill a child (yes a thirteen year old is still a child, sorry to all you teens reading this if you disagree). Was he having a bad day, was he emotionally distraught, did he not think this through at all? Yes to all of that, but child killing is something that this man is capable of. That's a part of him, its not going anywhere, there are no second acts in our lives, the things we do or are capable of, are things we will always be capable of or could always be able to do under the right circumstances. The past is real and we carry it with us. So the next time Conrad has a bad day, whose gonna pay? We cant get him mental help, we can't imprison him, we either let him live and wait for the next bad day, or we take care of the problem.
Sarah wasn't on the same level mentally as the others, Duck was younger than Sarah and never went out of his way to sabotage the group or make matters worse. Neither of these characters were put in a position to contribute to the group, so it's kinda unfair to make any comparisons to Gabe.
Most accurate comparison would be Ben imo. Both were able-bodied people who were at one point tasked with directly helping the group at least once during their seasons. Both made snap decisions on their own that hurt the rest of the group. Only difference I see right now is Ben showed remorse for his mistake, Gabe is so full of himself that he'd do it again in a heartbeat if he thought Clem would be impressed.
A voice of reason? Where'd you come from XD
In all seriousness your right, it's all a matter of opinion and not everyone is going to agree.
Anti-twd:anf train hyper speed ahead
Fellas, fellas, fellas, let's calm down and tone it down a notch please. It's starting to teeter towards insults and there's no need for that.
Guys, chillll, please. Let's try and debate in a more civil manner instead of retorting with personal attacks and/or rude retorts. Take a breather and relax.
Hey guys!
Just a friendly reminder, please tone it down a notch with personal attacks and rude comments. I've noticed a few comments in this thread are getting a bit heavy handed in regards to people being rude. Let's try to keep comments and debate civil, please. Thanks!
No need to disparage someone's beliefs....and you are comparing different things. You need to chill.
Kenny beat up arvo....wanted to kill Arvo....by the logic on display...putting him down was the right choice.
This.
Interestingly enough, here is what happens if you do nothing when asked to shoot Conrad/Accept the plan (skip to 7:36 if the video starts from the beginning):
Yes.
I don't have a problem justifying his screw ups on being a teen. I know I made the statement that he was worse than Sarah, Ben and Nick combined in an earlier thread but honestly I like all three of those characters. their mistakes and struggle to cope made them feel real, and before episode 4 I thought Gabe was alright too despite his shortcomings.
What I cannot forgive is Gabe being a total snitch because of something as petty as being treated like a little kid who doesn't know how to survive, which he is. Neither Ben nor Sarah tried to pretend to be useful when they weren't. All it does is make Gabe look like a brat on top of being incompetent.