Is Kenny really at fault? Did he really become a monster in Season 2?

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  • edited February 2016

    Getting brain damage doesn't mean you just die from it, are you not aware of that? Have you not known incidents where someone hits their head, loses their memory or becomes disabled but still lives? Brain damage can be a number of different things

    But if he did get brain damage , how would he have lived without treatment?

  • Brain damage can also kill you.

    dan290786 posted: »

    Getting brain damage doesn't mean you just die from it, are you not aware of that? Have you not known incidents where someone hits their head, loses their memory or becomes disabled but still lives? Brain damage can be a number of different things

  • [removed]

  • Please point out where I get "annoyed" at people saying negative things about Jane. I defend Jane, but I don't go over the top like you.

    dan290786 posted: »

    But i've seen you in other posts getting annoyed about people saying negative things about Jane or anything positive about Kenny so it's no different lol. And nahh if i was so butthurt about it I wouldn't stay on these forums

  • He willingly allows Clem to leave him. He doesn't put up a fight. He shows he loves that little girl, and is willing to give up his own happiness to save them. Kenny is the man.

    zykelator posted: »

    I'm going to say that 90%-ish of Kenny's actions are justified and/or have reasoning behind them I hope you are talking about breath

  • And who decides what 'real' grief is? Not everyone feels the same type of grief and it's not always as heavy for one person or as long term as it is for another, grief is grief - I don't think it's fair to tell people what true grief is but you have my condolences. Whether killing is normal doesn't make it any less extreme. I do believe that Kenny is truly a good person inside, like I've said several times before, I just dislike the extremes he goes to when he lashes out his anger on others, his irrational behavior poses as a danger for both Clementine and the group in my perspective and as much as I'd love to believe that Kenny had truly changed after Season 2, I'll have to witness this myself and see if his attitude changes in Season 3 or at least implications of that are evident. I understand taking out his frustration, and true he did apologize but whether an apology is enough to make up for taking out your aggression on someone really depends on perspective.

    To be honest, I don't personally understand how Kenny is seen as a villain, I can easily see how most characters can be seen as assholes but in my opinion - in a post-apocalyptic world, there are no heroes or villains, there are only people struggling to survive.

    Honestly, if I was starving, I think I wouldn't take food from a car, stealing isn't something I agree with, even if there's no one around to see it but at the same time if I had others with me, I'd probably be more likely to steal from an abandoned car because those people with me would be the reason I'm still living, so I'd do what I can to ensure they'd keep living. But really that question is rather irrelevant and more so a personal decision - not everyone would steal, believe it or not, I was just giving examples of how Kenny has shown to be selfish - even if understandably, you can't really excuse the fact that stealing from the Van ended up affecting The Stranger's family in a huge way. I can understand why people would steal rations but that doesn't mean I have to think it's okay.

    I painted Kenny and Katjaa as the ones responsible for it because they're the only ones who outright want to take from the car regardless of Lee's perspective on it.

    Determinantly, yes, but does that mean it should be ignored? There really aren't two Kennys, there's only one that shows a different attitude and aspect of his personality based on the decision of the main playable character. I personally liked Kenny but I only didn't fully side with him on about 3 things and not only did he tried to leave me to die, gave me crap for my decision and in the end, forgot all the times I helped his family and gave him and his family special treatment, heck, even sided with Kenny thinking he'd be a pretty good leader. But that's the thing, two different experiences on our part, neither is wrong, both are right.

    Probably because it's not something that is proven, yes, Kenny was hurt in the head by Carver pretty badly but there is that lack of evidence that truly suggest Kenny is brain-damaged, it's definitely possible but we can only speculate this as a possibility until someone from TTG or the game itself tells us that Kenny is brain damaged or not. Even so, it's still completely possible that this is just the way Kenny is, that he isn't brain-damaged at all, some people are the way they are and often that could be influenced by many variables that could take a while to sum up. Again, who 'truly' understands mental health? The thing is, regardless of why, Kenny is still the one to blame for his actions, as hurtful as that may sound, I'm not trying to say possibly having a mental health makes Kenny a bad person, I'm trying to say showing aggression towards people, making himself the unsolicited leader of the group and killing people - something that you can never fix or undo, can make him seem like a bad person to many people, of course it's a subjective matter but the consequences of his actions are still there, the same goes for everyone. I'm not fully answering your question, that's too personal a question to ask of someone but in short I wouldn't because I can't, my morals are what make me who I am, if I break my morals, I break the personal I've thrived to become and I wouldn't want to hurt people I cared about and of course I'd do everything I could to help them, most likely regardless of what they might have done.

    But at the same time, would you call people 'heartless' if they chose to leave a relative or friend behind because they keep hurting others? I don't think it's fair to keep saying "consider my point of view" when you yourself don't consider others and go on to just call them 'heartless', remember that different people have different perspectives on what's right or wrong. Don't apologize to anyone for having an opinion, this is a Forum where we express ourselves, never apologize for having an opinion, even if it's different from someone else's, also I don't think anyone can prove whether the majority on these forums like or hate Kenny, especially because opinions can change. I myself have forgiven Kenny but I haven't forgotten the bad things he's done that have affected others, I can easily forgive a person but I can't as easily forgive their actions. Again, I don't think it's fair to say everyone's done bad things - because you can't really prove that, especially since what's 'bad' is sometimes a subjective matter in certain situations. I have sympathy for every character in a game - 'good' or 'bad', even 'mutual', whether they're 'important' characters or 'background' characters - in the end, they're all still individuals that experience emotions/feelings and have their own struggles, but even if I like to sympathize with every character overtime, I don't think it's a bad thing if people chose not to sympathize with people whom I have sympathy for.

    I think the person I sympathize for the most in the TV Show is Michonne, she's gone through isolation, loss and near-death experiences but she always manages not to lose the person she thrives to be.

    But I wonder, since you brought on mental health, that could be a possibility for any character, including Clementine, Sarah, Carver, Jane and Arvo, it's even possible that everyone in a post-apocalyptic world could be experiencing the same or different mental health issues.

    dan290786 posted: »

    I can understand how losing someone could change you to the extent it changes Kenny but whether that's ok - even if it's out of your control

  • Having a reason doesn't always mean the action is justified, really that's subjective but I do agree that Kenny isn't a monster, he's a human being.

    I'm going to say that 90%-ish of Kenny's actions are justified and/or have reasoning behind them. That means to me that he isn't a monster,

  • edited February 2016

    I would except this site only shows the last 25 posts for each user. You had a long argument with someone to do with something a while back, it may have even been about Clementine and not Jane or Kenny at least im pretty certain it was you but anyway, defending Jane or any character obviously means you disagree and will have some annoyance to whoever makes a post for you to feel that way. If i go so over the top as you say well so be it. Sorry it bothers you but if i feel strongly about something im not going to just not say anything

    NOHATCLEM posted: »

    Please point out where I get "annoyed" at people saying negative things about Jane. I defend Jane, but I don't go over the top like you.

  • He doesn't allow her to leave.

    He straight up begs Clem and AJ, the only things he has left to care about, to stay at Wellington for their own safety. I don't understand how people can ignore this when they criticise Kenny, it's more selfless than absolutely anything Jane did.

    Sanders12 posted: »

    He willingly allows Clem to leave him. He doesn't put up a fight. He shows he loves that little girl, and is willing to give up his own happiness to save them. Kenny is the man.

  • edited February 2016

    Nice post marccost3 thank you for sharing and i agree.

    marccost3 posted: »

    To be honest, it's just shitty writing. Season 2 forces you into thinking that Kenny is shit and Jane is good. No, Kenny isn't a monster

  • Yes it can indeed. Let's all wear helmets

    Brain damage can also kill you.

  • @KCohere Its possible to take things too far,over and over,then in the last moments of your struggle realize how wrong you were. Kenny knew he was out. of bounds. But could not control his rage. Should doing the right thing in the end free him of guilt? No, I think not. But if you as Clem,stay at Wellington with AJ, you can give him the small dignity of having "saved you". To me that's the cooler story. The more layered, and heartbreaking ending. Therefore making it very much like many Season finals on the TV show. This in my view, explains why so many champion Kenny. His story is far better than his charcter! Hope this helped you understand. With all that said in my first playthru both Kenny and Jane were dead. THX for listening.

    KCohere posted: »

    Nice attack on non Kenny fans. I guess Im too stubborn to get why he's so awesome.

  • GubaLord posted: »

    Kenny is the incarnation of Jesus Christ. How could be Jesus a monster?

  • A-IBRAHIM0702A-IBRAHIM0702 Banned
    edited February 2016

    This is just the beginning my friend. I have yet to post a Season 2 version of how awesome Kenny is.

    enter image description here

    dan290786 posted: »

    It's funny how you say sarcastically how horrible Kenny is and yet what you're posting makes you no better than the horrible guy you are ins

  • Or bad 'Kenny'

    UrbanRodrik posted: »

    i think that was bad writing lol

  • edited February 2016

    Season 2 forces you into thinking that Kenny is shit and Jane is good.

    Oh brother. Well clearly not since you don't think Kenny's shit and you've played season 2.

    Also I don't understand how you can think that in season 2 the writers made Kenny look shit, but also think that everything kenny did in season 2 was great. Bizarre logic.

    marccost3 posted: »

    To be honest, it's just shitty writing. Season 2 forces you into thinking that Kenny is shit and Jane is good. No, Kenny isn't a monster

  • That post when on and on because that user wouldn't shutup XD and constantly attacked me after I settled down and told them that I would agree to disagree. I know you feel strongly about Kenny, it is known. But you don't have to tell someone they're just as bad as a character because they posted a sarcastic comment about them.

    dan290786 posted: »

    I would except this site only shows the last 25 posts for each user. You had a long argument with someone to do with something a while back,

  • Its not like he could stop her from leaving. You talk as if she was his property.

    Im pretty sure he doesnt care too much about Clem, as shown before, its more about AJ.

    Sanders12 posted: »

    He willingly allows Clem to leave him. He doesn't put up a fight. He shows he loves that little girl, and is willing to give up his own happiness to save them. Kenny is the man.

  • So when suicidal man does something for others, its extremely selfless? If he actually valued his life, i would've seen it as selfless act. The fact that they walked to north wearing almost nothing and having no food or proper destination doesnt really strike me as proper plan, so if the stories about wellington were false or they just didnt find it, the plan was suicidal and not very thoughtful for clem & aj

    Clem4S3 posted: »

    He doesn't allow her to leave. He straight up begs Clem and AJ, the only things he has left to care about, to stay at Wellington for the

  • edited February 2016

    That post when on and on because that user wouldn't shutup XD and constantly attacked me after I settled down and told them that I would agree to disagree.

    Oh ok well fair enough then.

    I know you feel strongly about Kenny, it is known. But you don't have to tell someone they're just as bad as a character because they posted a sarcastic comment about them.

    Well i was pointing it out that all the things he/she was saying that Kenny had done in a bad/horrible way is just the same and no different as all the horrible things he/she was saying about him. What's the difference? If Kenny is being an asshole to someone but then someone then starts bad mouthing him as well, it's the same thing. It makes them no better for it which is why i said the person is just as bad or if you prefer me to rephrase it, "the same" as Kenny and his attitude etc.

    NOHATCLEM posted: »

    That post when on and on because that user wouldn't shutup XD and constantly attacked me after I settled down and told them that I would agr

  • Awesome. Look forward to criticising it lol :)

    This is just the beginning my friend. I have yet to post a Season 2 version of how awesome Kenny is.

  • Sounds like an excellent idea. Maybe it will keep Kenny from beating up ANOTHER person in Season Three!

    dan290786 posted: »

    Yes it can indeed. Let's all wear helmets

  • Well I know what i'm doing this weekend.

    I've noticed this last couple of days that the Wikia glorifies Kenny and demonizes Lilly and Jane. You just have to go there and read their

  • But you could also argue that it was irresponsible of Christa and Omid to split up the group.

    zykelator posted: »

    seeming to blame Clem. Well it was her fault after all.

  • How surprising.

    dan290786 posted: »

    Nice post marccost3 thank you for sharing and i agree.

  • I'm starting to feel increasing hostility towards people like this guy. What about you , KCohere?

    KCohere posted: »

    Seriously with this?

  • This is where people go too far.

    GubaLord posted: »

    Kenny is the incarnation of Jesus Christ. How could be Jesus a monster?

  • Hostility towards people who call others 'shitheads' for disagreeing that Kenny is a 'saint' doesn't seem particularly problematic to me.

    I'm starting to feel increasing hostility towards people like this guy. What about you , KCohere?

  • edited February 2016

    Well that last part, he was willing to be on his own for the safety of Clem and AJ. Isn't that selfless? I don't see how its not.

    I've noticed this last couple of days that the Wikia glorifies Kenny and demonizes Lilly and Jane. You just have to go there and read their

  • So he is selfless for allowing these kids who he is attached to to go somewhere safer? Would Kenny have had the right to prohibit them to do so?

    Sanders12 posted: »

    He willingly allows Clem to leave him. He doesn't put up a fight. He shows he loves that little girl, and is willing to give up his own happiness to save them. Kenny is the man.

  • edited February 2016

    Round of a fuckin' applause to this individual. I still don't know how this flame war hasn't died yet. Everyone is arguing over the rushed writing of season 2, and that in its self is funny.

    marccost3 posted: »

    To be honest, it's just shitty writing. Season 2 forces you into thinking that Kenny is shit and Jane is good. No, Kenny isn't a monster

  • My point is proven.

    Flog61 posted: »

    Hostility towards people who call others 'shitheads' for disagreeing that Kenny is a 'saint' doesn't seem particularly problematic to me.

  • Sure, he's sort of a mess

    Glad to see that you realize this.

    but the guy lost his kid, and his wife, and the next woman he loved

    Just like, who was it… everyone else on this game? If you don't see somebody's family, they're most likely dead. Don't get me wrong, Kenny also went through this and it was traumatic, but you can't put him on higher ground just because of this reason.

    Anyone who thinks differently is a complete shithead.

    Thanks. That's good forum etiquette.

  • It's not like he was in the right to force them to be with him, is it? They weren't his property.

    AGentlman posted: »

    Well that last part, he was willing to be on his own for the safety of Clem and AJ. Isn't that selfless? I don't see how its not.

  • Sanders12Sanders12 Banned
    edited February 2016

    I don't care if it's forum etiquette. If I think a group of people are terrible, I'm going to say I think those people are terrible. I think Jane supporters are terrible human beings.

    Sure, he's sort of a mess Glad to see that you realize this. but the guy lost his kid, and his wife, and the next woman he lov

  • I think comparing Kenny to a saint is just silly, like that other poster saying he is the reincarnation of Jesus, but whatever. I get really irritated with the attacks against fans. I try not to make my distate for characters personal against fans and I dont know why some fans cant do the same.

    I'm starting to feel increasing hostility towards people like this guy. What about you , KCohere?

  • I am a 'he' actually

    dan290786 posted: »

    That post when on and on because that user wouldn't shutup XD and constantly attacked me after I settled down and told them that I would agr

  • edited February 2016

    Lmao I wouldn't take the Jesus thing too seriously. Was clearly just a joke and the video showing Kenny as Jesus was pretty funny.

    KCohere posted: »

    I think comparing Kenny to a saint is just silly, like that other poster saying he is the reincarnation of Jesus, but whatever. I get really

  • Not really it was the girl who killed Omid Clem didn't know someone would walk in and take her gun.

    zykelator posted: »

    seeming to blame Clem. Well it was her fault after all.

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