Can't blame him for this. There is no way he could have known Carver's intentions. Carver could have just killed everyone after Kenny surrendered. Kenny more than had reason enough to handle the situation the way that he did.
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that what Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
The actual beating only took like an extra 20 seconds. I think we can excuse Kenny for that considering he was the one who actually did something in the first place. How long would everyone have argued about what to do with Carver? Its just nitpicky to criticize Kenny for this.
Without this happening, Sarita wouldnt have lost hope with Kenny. She even says "i wish...i thought i could save him".
And, if they just killed Carver asap and left, Carlos and possibly Sarita could have survived walking through the herd.
He could have just shot him to the head and left, but he wanted to do it.
How was he acting like a dictator at all? Are you saying that just because he was angry about people not agreeing with him about Wellington? Mike and Bonnie split from the group because they were stupid.
They split because Kenny treated their prisoner like shit all the time and he didnt show any signs of wanting to be part of the team.
Kind of funny how you're indirectly trying to pin Clem getting shot on Kenny, considering Kenny was the only one in the group who knew better than to trust some stupid kid who had just lit up his entire group only a day ago. If everyone had listened to Kenny, Arvo wouldn't have even been there to shoot Clem. The group wouldn't have wasted their time with Arvo at all, and Luke would have still been alive.
"I got the car started so i say where we are going" Doesnt that sound like dictatorship? Arvo had a reason to shoot Clementine, but the fact that Kenny made Arvo seem lesser evil to group than Kenny, made it possible for Arvo to shoot Clementine. If they didnt let Arvo live, then they would have never reached the house, wouldnt have found the food, wouldnt have the car and the whole trip would have been different. The violence was pointless. Beating crippled teen 2-3 times while he doesnt resist.
So just because you don't have evidence of the place existing that means there isn't any merit in checking it out? It was a higher risk- higher reward scenario, and worth looking into.
I don't know why everyone acts like traveling up north is some sort of death trap. If Wellington turned out to be nothing but a myth, the group could just turn around and go back... not a big deal.
Like they said before, they will freeze to death. They had no proper clothing for winter and they didnt have any food for the baby. Not that this matters, but even if they followed Kennys plan, they would have been forced to return because Wellington is full. Kenny was ready to sacrifice everyone just because he believed there was safe haven in the north. If i had literally nothing to lose, no hope left, i would go search for Wellington, but i wouldnt force everyone to go search it with me.
Caused Walter to die and was ready to let Alvin die
Can't blame him for this. There is no way he could have known Carver's intention… mores. Carver could have just killed everyone after Kenny surrendered. Kenny more than had reason enough to handle the situation the way that he did.
wanted to rambo his way out of the truck and possibly get himself & someone else killed
I personally don't side with him on his decision making here either, but people fail to look at his side of the argument for whatever reason. In his mind, the truck was the perfect opportunity for escape, compared to actually getting locked away somewhere. And to be fair, his plan actually had a good chance of working if everyone had listened to him. Troy, Tavia, and Bonnie were standing right outside the back of the truck with their guns lowered. They could have been overpowered.
Wasted time beating Carvers dead corpse, costing the group time. (it was… [view original content]
He's just going to keep acting like Kenny sat and made a rational choice rather than the more obvious knee-jerk reaction Kenny had. Kenny as a character has never been one for sitting back and thinking things out.
Kenny's entire character can be summed up by one sentence:
"I don't know what the fuck you're saying, but I know it's bullshit." - Kenny
No rational person would say that something they don't understand is bullshit. If he can't understand it he can't know whether it's bullshit or not. It wasn't bullshit, but Kenny wouldn't know that.
Can't blame him for this. There is no way he could have known Carver's intentions. Carver could have just killed everyone after Kenny surren… moredered. Kenny more than had reason enough to handle the situation the way that he did.
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that what Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
The actual beating only took like an extra 20 seconds. I think we can excuse Kenny for that considering he was the one who actually did something in the first place. How long would everyone have argued about what to do with Carver? Its just nitpicky to criticize Kenny for this.
Without this happening, Sarita would… [view original content]
Just the fact that Kenny cares about Clementine and Aj and he has lost loved ones makes all the bad things he cause ok. Double standards are strong with some Kenny fans. If Jane cares about Clementine, she is manipulative selfish bitch.
He's just going to keep acting like Kenny sat and made a rational choice rather than the more obvious knee-jerk reaction Kenny had. Kenny as… more a character has never been one for sitting back and thinking things out.
Kenny's entire character can be summed up by one sentence:
"I don't know what the fuck you're saying, but I know it's bullshit." - Kenny
No rational person would say that something they don't understand is bullshit. If he can't understand it he can't know whether it's bullshit or not. It wasn't bullshit, but Kenny wouldn't know that.
One person even claims that the story is Biblical - Kenny is Jesus and Jane is Satan.
I think Kenny is the perfect example of "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." I think he means well and he tries to do the right thing but in the process he does more harm than good.
"You're.... You know... Urban" - Kenny
Just the fact that Kenny cares about Clementine and Aj and he has lost loved ones makes all the ba… mored things he cause ok. Double standards are strong with some Kenny fans. If Jane cares about Clementine, she is manipulative selfish bitch.
They put that baby in a lot of danger to chase after ghosts. If they had been wrong, AJ would have been doomed
How do you figure tha… moret? Considering AJ made the 9 day trip just fine, they clearly had some sort of plan for him that was working. If Wellington turned out to be bogus, they could have just gone back with AJ being potentially fine.
Nevermind that going back to Howe's to find formula first was probably a good idea. They could have gone back to find supplies and then gone to Wellington but noooo.
That was the point of Kenny telling the group that they were going into the small city for supplies at the end of Episode Four. Considering the baby was basically out of formula before heading up to Wellington but still managed to be fine after nine days of travel, we can assume that Kenny had something figured out.
One person even claims that the story is Biblical - Kenny is Jesus and Jane is Satan.
I think Kenny is the perfect example of "the road t… moreo hell is paved with good intentions." I think he means well and he tries to do the right thing but in the process he does more harm than good.
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that what Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
"We have to remember that Kenny knew absolutely nothing about Carver and his group, and he knew nothing of their intentions. Us as the player didn’t even know a lot at the time, but we at least had a general idea. In hindsight it is very easy for us to look back at Kenny’s actions and call them reckless, but we need to understand this is only because we know what the outcome of the situation is. Kenny had no idea what would happen in the case of him surrendering. Seriously, why would he just assume that Carver (someone he knows nothing about) would spare everyone’s life if he laid down his gun and gave himself up? As far as he knew, Carver could have just gunned down the entire group once he had them all at his mercy. After surrendering, there was nothing stopping Carver from killing everyone and walking away with Rebecca and the baby."
What was the alternative option to dealing with the situation? Surrendering. Upon surrendering, there would be nothing stopping Carver from killing everyone (minus Rebecca of course). Giving up potentially could have been a death sentence for everyone.
Without this happening, Sarita wouldnt have lost hope with Kenny. She even says "i wish...i thought i could save him".
So? We don't even know what would have or would not have come out of that considering she died (or was mortally wounded) minutes later. All we know is that she was disappointed in his moral decision making.
And, if they just killed Carver asap and left, Carlos and possibly Sarita could have survived walking through the herd.
Man, and only if Jane hadn't taken so long to shoot Troy, Carlos would have been approximately 2.2ft away from his original position of getting shot and everything could have been totally fine. Or what if everyone had covered themselves in walker guts a little faster? That could have changed everything! Right?? What if Carlos had simply walked behind Sarah instead of in front of her??? Bullet would never have hit him..
Its just silly to argue about this kind of thing. The overall situation didn't change. Carlos was simply unlucky.
They split because Kenny treated their prisoner like shit all the time and he didnt show any signs of wanting to be part of the team.
Didn't show any signs of wanting to be a part of the team? That's why he put his intense grief to the side to go deliver someone else's baby, right? That's why he let go of his self pity when the group came running to him for leadership? He showed as much desire to be a part of the team as anyone else did.
And yes, he didn't treat Arvo very well. Bonnie and Mike separating from everyone else (+taking all the supplies) because of that reason is just unreasonable and absolutely scumbag-ish though. Even though Kenny was the reason why they left, their reasons for doing so were laughably terrible. That's why everyone hates them.
"I got the car started so i say where we are going" Doesnt that sound like dictatorship?
So one line in a moment of anger makes him some kind of dictator?
Arvo had a reason to shoot Clementine, but the fact that Kenny made Arvo seem lesser evil to group than Kenny, made it possible for Arvo to shoot Clementine.
So in other words, it's Kenny's fault that Mike and Bonnie made a stupid decision?
If they didnt let Arvo live, then they would have never reached the house, wouldnt have found the food, wouldnt have the car and the whole trip would have been different.
Of course the group did reap some benefits of doing what Arvo wanted, but that doesn't change the fact that Kenny was right about the guy. Kenny didn't want to trust him. Everyone else did, even to the point that Arvo is even given a gun. Clementine ends up getting shot and nearly killed by the guy everyone was so ridiculously quick to trust. Lets also not forget the fact that Arvo played a hand in causing the death of Luke, because of selfish reasons.
Like they said before, they will freeze to death. They had no proper clothing for winter and they didnt have any food for the baby.
Obviously that isn't true though, considering Clem, Kenny, and the baby were just fine. They had a heated vehicle, and obtained supplies from elsewhere. Of course there was a risk increase, but that doesn't mean the plan was suicidal or not doable.
Can't blame him for this. There is no way he could have known Carver's intentions. Carver could have just killed everyone after Kenny surren… moredered. Kenny more than had reason enough to handle the situation the way that he did.
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that what Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
The actual beating only took like an extra 20 seconds. I think we can excuse Kenny for that considering he was the one who actually did something in the first place. How long would everyone have argued about what to do with Carver? Its just nitpicky to criticize Kenny for this.
Without this happening, Sarita would… [view original content]
You sure are making a lot of assumptions about Wellington. We have no clue what's really going on in there. And if there's going to be a sea… moreson 3 with Clementine as the protag, then clearly the place can't be all sunshine and roses and perfection.
Plus, Kenny was taking a shot in the dark and got lucky as hell that he was right. They put that baby in a lot of danger to chase after ghosts. If they had been wrong, AJ would have been doomed. But Kenny didn't seem to care about that, because he was convinced it was out there so that was that. Nevermind that going back to Howe's to find formula first was probably a good idea. They could have gone back to find supplies and then gone to Wellington but noooo.
He's just going to keep acting like Kenny sat and made a rational choice rather than the more obvious knee-jerk reaction Kenny had. Kenny as… more a character has never been one for sitting back and thinking things out.
Kenny's entire character can be summed up by one sentence:
"I don't know what the fuck you're saying, but I know it's bullshit." - Kenny
No rational person would say that something they don't understand is bullshit. If he can't understand it he can't know whether it's bullshit or not. It wasn't bullshit, but Kenny wouldn't know that.
What was the alternative option to dealing with the situation? Surrendering. Upon surrendering, there would be nothing stopping Carver from killing everyone (minus Rebecca of course). Giving up potentially could have been a death sentence for everyone.
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... It was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
Man, and only if Jane hadn't taken so long to shoot Troy, Carlos would have been approximately 2.2ft away from his original position of getting shot and everything could have been totally fine. Or what if everyone had covered themselves in walker guts a little faster? That could have changed everything! Right?? What if Carlos had simply walked behind Sarah instead of in front of her??? Bullet would never have hit him..
They spent more than few minutes inside after Carver was disarmed and could have been killed.
Didn't show any signs of wanting to be a part of the team? That's why he put his intense grief to the side to go deliver someone else's baby, right? That's why he let go of his self pity when the group came running to him for leadership? He showed as much desire to be a part of the team as anyone else did.
I was talking about the situation in the house/car. He didnt care about anyones opinion, even Clementines and he was ready to go against 4 other people because HE wanted to go search for hope in the north.
So in other words, it's Kenny's fault that Mike and Bonnie made a stupid decision?
How was it stupid to go away from someone who is violent and doesnt think before doing?
Lets also not forget the fact that Arvo played a hand in causing the death of Luke, because of selfish reasons.
Lets not forget that Kenny played a hand in causing the death of Lee, the Stranger, wife, and daughter, because of selfish reasons. Arvo robs others and Kenny robs others. Only difference is that you like Kenny and that justifies his behaviour.
Realistically, they shouldnt have survived 9 days in cold with those clothes.
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that wha… moret Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
"We have to remember that Kenny knew absolutely nothing about Carver and his group, and he knew nothing of their intentions. Us as the player didn’t even know a lot at the time, but we at least had a general idea. In hindsight it is very easy for us to look back at Kenny’s actions and call them reckless, but we need to understand this is only because we know what the outcome of the situation is. Kenny had no idea what would happen in the case of him surrendering. Seriously, why would he just assume that Carver (someone he knows nothing about) would … [view original content]
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... It was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
You're not understanding. The only other alternative was Kenny surrendering. There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop Carver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up. It could even be argued that giving up is the riskier move, considering everyone is then left at the mercy of a mad man.
If you personally would lean towards giving up there, that's fine, but that doesn't mean the other side of the argument is stupid.
They spent more than few minutes inside after Carver was disarmed and could have been killed.
Only because Kenny took awhile to enact his plan (technically because Carver had to speak for dramatic purposes..). By the time Kenny got around to killing him, it only took 20 seconds. It really doesn't even matter though, you're ignoring the fact that Carlos's death was simply because he was standing in the wrong place at the wrong time, due to a variety of factors. You can't just tie that directly to Kenny specifically taking too long to do something. That's just silly. There are so many other "what-ifs" that are involved.
What if Kenny decided not to do anything in regards to Carver's fate at all? Would Carlos have lived? Who knows. It's pointless to argue either way.
I was talking about the situation in the house/car. He didnt care about anyones opinion, even Clementines and he was ready to go against 4 other people because HE wanted to go search for hope in the north.
He was being stubborn about one plan of action, so that means he never showed any signs of wanting to be part of the team? What kind of reasoning is that? That just erases everything? And let's be honest, he had everyone's best interests in mind (obviously, considering he thought his idea was prudent).
How was it stupid to go away from someone who is violent and doesnt think before doing?
Because Kenny never actually did anything to seriously harm them. Arvo on the other hand, clearly wished harm on the group. Arvo was the one who had been a clear enemy to the group. Kenny was never that guy. It made literally no sense at all to side with Arvo, let alone give him a gun.
Lets not forget that Kenny played a hand in causing the death of Lee, the Stranger, wife, and daughter, because of selfish reasons. Arvo robs others and Kenny robs others. Only difference is that you like Kenny and that justifies his behaviour.
First of all, Kenny had literally nothing to do with the death of Lee.
Second of all, the Stranger situation is basically the worst comparison ever. I'm so sick of the apples-oranges comparisons.. what Arvo did was clearly very different both in circumstance and intent.
Realistically, they shouldnt have survived 9 days in cold with those clothes.
Because you know exactly how cold it was outside, right? Did you have the 7 day forecast on hand?
What should they have been wearing exactly? Parkas? They had a heated car.
What was the alternative option to dealing with the situation? Surrendering. Upon surrendering, there would be nothing stopping Carver from … morekilling everyone (minus Rebecca of course). Giving up potentially could have been a death sentence for everyone.
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... It was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
Man, and only if Jane hadn't taken so long to shoot Troy, Carlos would have been approximately 2.2ft away from his original position of getting shot and everything could have been totally fine. Or what if everyone had covered themselves in walker guts a little faster? That could have changed everything! Right?? What if Carlos had simply walked behind Sarah instead of in front of her??? Bullet would never have hit him..
They spent more than few minutes inside afte… [view original content]
Don't worry, that wasn't directed towards you - that was a general warning.
Long before this thread, people here have had problems with p… moreersonally insulting other users for their opinions of fictional characters. This isn't anything new.
Also, welcome to the forums!
Thats just your opinions based off your distorted viewpoints. Where i come from people who tell others to ditch/kill their babies and are Ok leaving babies in cars surrounded by walkers are the mentally unstable ones. Good thing that baby cried after Jane got killed otherwise she murdered that baby too. Clementine voiced serious concerns about Jane ditching her. Do you not get that people say your a joke because of your inability to realize that your own thoughts and views aren't the only valid ones? Why are u even here? I had to flag your posts where you were threatening to kill yourself on this thread and the moderators deleted them, I hoped you wouldn't come back. Your just a toxic person who has no ability to see past their own beliefs.
Every opinion isnt equally good. If someone said its safest to go with Arvo, could you take that opinion seriously?
I try to give good poin… morets and make others understand why it is the safest way, but they just ignore/discredit everything.
Many people dont even understand what rationality means. If the safety & survival of Clementine is your priority, doing everything to ensure this is the most rational thing to do. Now, either people think its safe to be around mentally unstable violent man, which sounds completely delusional, or they just dont care about Clementines safety and survival.
If survival of Kenny and your friendship is the priority, letting Kenny murder Jane is the most rational thing to do.
people who ingnore instead of refute points, and resort to name calling obviously realize they are losing the argument. By the way ive seen several hostage situations ended when the swat team does a breach entry and flashbangs and gas and kills all the hostage takers. Also at least one one i can remember where a couple swat snipers ended it when the hostage taker got too close to a window. Im not saying Kenny is a swat team, simply that your premise that real life hostage situations never invovle the police using violence is BS. I always wondered why France just surrendered to Germany in WWII. Perhaps too many people who think surrender always has the best outcome.
Kenny is the classic example of 'the road to hell is paved with good intentions.' Very few people try to do the wrong thing. The problem is … morethat trying to do the right thing doesn't mean you're doing the right thing nor does it give you a free pass from the consequences.
I feel sympathy for Kenny but his grief doesn't justify his actions. His grief doesn't give him a free pass.
There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop Carver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up.
The problem with that is - If he surrenders people might die. If he doesn't people will die. A hostage is leverage for protection and a means to an end. A hostage taker will kill hostages to press that leverage. The logical thing to do is surrender because the odds for the hostages surviving are better. You can't seem to figure that out.
If you honestly believe that Kenny put much thought into what he was doing you haven't been paying attention.
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... I… moret was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
You're not understanding. The only other alternative was Kenny surrendering. There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop Carver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up. It could even be argued that giving up is the riskier move, considering everyone is then left at the mercy of a mad man.
If you personally would lean towards giving up there, that's fine, but that doesn't mean the other side of the argument is stupid.
They spent more than few minutes inside after Carver was disarmed and could have been killed.
Only because Kenny took awhile to enact his plan (technically because Carver… [view original content]
I know that. I was just speaking specifically about zykelator though, who is a prominent Jane fan. I didn't bring up Kenny/Kenny fans, because it didn't really have anything to do with what I was addressing in my first post.(personally, Lemoncakes doesn't bother me, his "troll posts" can often be clever and are quite funny to me lol)
i will agree with that, but you have to remember that there are assholes on both sides, i dont want to be associated with Lemoncakes, just because im a Kenny fan too
The problem with that is - If he surrenders people might die. If he doesn't people will die. A hostage is leverage for protection and a means to an end. A hostage taker will kill hostages to press that leverage. The logical thing to do is surrender because the odds for the hostages surviving are better. You can't seem to figure that out.
What you cant seem to figure out is that you think your so smart with the benefit of hindsight, when in reality, the truth is nobody knows the future. Again this just sounds like a pacifists or cowards justification for surrender. Lets put all our lives in the hands of Carver and hope hes nice. If he had been somebody else besides Carver he would have killed EVERYONE. He uses the hostages to draw out everyone then kills them since he doesnt need that leverage anymore. Your seriously trying to use probability to prove your point when your basing it off nothing but your opinion. There is no evidence that says your more likely to get less people killed if u surrender to armed hostage takers. And that is exactly why nobody actually gives in to terrorist demands unless they are stupid. And for God's sake dont say something like "uh well common sense is what im basing it on" because ill go ahead and fine you 3 real life stories of people who surrendered in hostage situations and were immediately shot dead the moment they dropped their weapon, and vice versa 3 stories of people getting out of hostage situations by attacking their captors.
By the way I could also say with just as much conviction, If he surrenders everybody WILL DIE, if he fights he may be able to distract them so that some get away, He might be able to kill them before they kill all the hostages. But if surrenders he will kill them all. You have no way of proving me wrong without hindsight. You guys wanna take wellington away from us because of hindsight? Well it applies here as well then.
The sickest things is that your trying to take the murder of Walter and blame it on Kenny when it should be solely on Carvers hands.
There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop C… morearver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up.
The problem with that is - If he surrenders people might die. If he doesn't people will die. A hostage is leverage for protection and a means to an end. A hostage taker will kill hostages to press that leverage. The logical thing to do is surrender because the odds for the hostages surviving are better. You can't seem to figure that out.
If you honestly believe that Kenny put much thought into what he was doing you haven't been paying attention.
"Treats Arvo like shit for no good reason" -- zykelator
Yeah, It's not like Arvo had just brought his gang of Russians to mug/threaten Kenny's group or anything. Its not like Arvo's actions had led to a blood bath... right?
It was a complete miracle that no one in the group had been killed. -- Belan
Wow that exchange was pure ownage, LMAO nice job Belan. By the way lets not forget that the whole ARVO situation was provoked by your hero Jane. So lets use your logic of Kenny is actually responsible for getting CLEM shot. ACTUALLY, HERP A DERP, IM SO SMART AND I DONT HAVE OPINIONS ONLY FACTS AND RATIONALITY AND LOGIC AND STUFF, AND I REMEMBER THAT JANE STOLE FROM ARVO EVEN AFTER CLEM SAID NOT TOO! AND SHE HELD A GUN TO HIS HEAD FOR NO GOOD REASON AND STOLE HIS GUN TOO!!! FOR NO GOOD REASON!!! SO JANE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ARVO COMING AFTER THE GROUP AND FOR LUKES DEATH AND FOR CLEM BEING SHOT!!
Woah it hurts my brain to even pretend to be zykelator. But hey there u go a taste of your own medicine. Explain to me why its not Janes fault for getting a group of russians mad at us in the first place? Clem did nothing to provoke him.
First of all, Kenny is on 2 seasons and he has ridiculous screen time compared to Jane.
1. Jane saved the group from Troy outside howe's
2… more. Taught everyone how to pass through herds (clementine knew this but she didnt mention/remember it)
2. She made sure Clementine and Rebecca got out of the herd safely
3. She saved Luke from the trailer
4. ice incident and later getting the fire started.
On 2nd season, Kenny put Clementine or other people more in danger than was being helpful.
* Caused Walter to die and was ready to let Alvin die
* wanted to rambo his way out of the truck and possibly get himself & someone else killed
* Forced Clementine to take the walkie talkie, putting her at huge risk
* Wasted time beating Carvers dead corpse, costing the group time. (it was a fucking escape plan... You dont just stop to bash someones face in)
* Wants Rebecca to move after just one day of recovery (she dies anyway, but it was stupid… [view original content]
He's been right about important stuff ever since Season 1 tbh, but people forget it because of his anger issues
He was the one who suspected the dairy and urged Lee to investigate,he insisted the motor inn wasn't safe for the longest time and that they should leave it ASAP before the bandits tried to take it over,he predicted Lilly would snap eventually, he said there'd be a boat in Savannah, he distrusted Vernon from the start, he said they shouldn't leave the boat unattended while they search for Clem...
Kirkman himself said taking a boat out in the water and trying to find a secluded place in the water was probably the best thing one could do in the ZA, and that was Kenny's plan...
If the safety & survival of Clementine is your priority, doing everything to ensure this is the most rational thing to do. Now, either people think its safe to be around mentally unstable violent man, which sounds completely delusional, or they just dont care about Clementines safety and survival. --zykelator
Oh by the way, last time I checked it was Janes violent instability and sticky fingers that made a group of russians hunt down the group looking for vengeance. How is angering other groups, especially a group of gun toting Russians, "increasing our own survival" and making Clementine a priority? Jane didnt listen to Clem when she said not to steal from Arvo, and she put a freaking gun to his head and stole from him for NO GOOD REASON! Jane set everything in motion which culminated in Arvo shooting Clem and stealing all the groups supplies. Yeah good job Jane.
Every opinion isnt equally good. If someone said its safest to go with Arvo, could you take that opinion seriously?
I try to give good poin… morets and make others understand why it is the safest way, but they just ignore/discredit everything.
Many people dont even understand what rationality means. If the safety & survival of Clementine is your priority, doing everything to ensure this is the most rational thing to do. Now, either people think its safe to be around mentally unstable violent man, which sounds completely delusional, or they just dont care about Clementines safety and survival.
If survival of Kenny and your friendship is the priority, letting Kenny murder Jane is the most rational thing to do.
Well, where there is smoke there is fire. At least that's what I always believed.
We've heard about Wellington so much in the game, from Christa, Carver , Matthew, Kenny... It had to be out there, for a rumor to spread like that in a world where there's hardly any communication anymore.
If we're going to work with "ifs" , Jane's stunt to prove a point was pretty reckless too in regards to the baby's safety. If he started crying and walkers were nearby...
You sure are making a lot of assumptions about Wellington. We have no clue what's really going on in there. And if there's going to be a sea… moreson 3 with Clementine as the protag, then clearly the place can't be all sunshine and roses and perfection.
Plus, Kenny was taking a shot in the dark and got lucky as hell that he was right. They put that baby in a lot of danger to chase after ghosts. If they had been wrong, AJ would have been doomed. But Kenny didn't seem to care about that, because he was convinced it was out there so that was that. Nevermind that going back to Howe's to find formula first was probably a good idea. They could have gone back to find supplies and then gone to Wellington but noooo.
I hate to say it, but the best choice was leaving BOTH Kenny and Jane! They were both right about things, but they were both really bad in a group. You saw it yourself in the last episode, neither Jane or Kenny wanted to be with the group. Even though Kenny loved/loves AJ and Clem his anger gets the best of him and he puts them in danger, he is/was reckless and has not been reliable since WAY back in episode 3 season 1 when Duck and Katjaa died. As for Jane, she only likes strong people in her group and she doesn't really care what happens to the weak ones. She likes/liked Clem, but its seems like she would leave AJ in a heartbeat to protect herself, on the other hand she does do a GREAT job surviving in the dead world only because she has/had very little feelings for others. So I don't know how anyone can think these two are good for Clem and AJ! In the end when you think about it Clems best choice was with Luke's group and that was fine until Carver showed up and then things went to hell. I really wish Luke survived he was the best person for Clem!
(sorry to say this) you are a pretty hardcore Kenny fan (not even near being one of the worst) but if you look at @Lemoncakes posts from a Jane fan perspective, you will find that he is a really annoying guy, who take huge dumps on others opinions
I know that. I was just speaking specifically about zykelator though, who is a prominent Jane fan. I didn't bring up Kenny/Kenny fans, becau… morese it didn't really have anything to do with what I was addressing in my first post.(personally, Lemoncakes doesn't bother me, his "troll posts" can often be clever and are quite funny to me lol)
The point of the choices is that people pick what they prefer and who they would prefer to stay with. If people want to be with jane let them jeezuz wheezuz
lol its so true though. Few would dare even argue that the Jane endings are in any way shape or form a more positive outcome (in terms of sa… morefety/survival/security) for Clem or AJ. Wellington has the walls, a large community, tons of resources, etc. etc. She could have a normal life. And yet it seems as though people choke the ending they got down because their pride wont let them admit they got duped into killing the person who cared about them most. They are forced to defend eating their shit ending forever lol. Cracks me up so hard.
It's ok, I don't take any offense. I do see how Jane fans would be annoyed by Lemoncake's posts, but it's hard for me to be, because of the way he so cleverly intertwines logic with major shit talking. Even when he says it in a way that I very much disagree with(often somewhat callous and blunt), I have to give him props for his impressive prose. That doesn't necessarily mean I condone everything he says though.(I also don't know how good of an idea it was to tag him in your post, if you don't want to be associated with him..)
(sorry to say this) you are a pretty hardcore Kenny fan (not even near being one of the worst) but if you look at @Lemoncakes posts from a Jane fan perspective, you will find that he is a really annoying guy, who take huge dumps on others opinions
It's ok, I don't take any offense. I do see how Jane fans would be annoyed by Lemoncake's posts, but it's hard for me to be, because of the… more way he so cleverly intertwines logic with major shit talking. Even when he says it in a way that I very much disagree with(often somewhat callous and blunt), I have to give him props for his impressive prose. That doesn't necessarily mean I condone everything he says though.(I also don't know how good of an idea it was to tag him in your post, if you don't want to be associated with him..)
Well clearly you havent played the game at all, since you dont know different outcomes.
Only reason Jane considered to steal from Arvo, was because our group was in really bad shape. And the reason she threatened Arvo, was so he wouldnt come back, knowing that they would kill him. If you decided to do as Jane proposed and steal from Arvo, he comes back and tries to rob your group and sure, you can blame Jane for that, even if her intentions were to benefit the group with medicine.
If you decide to not steal from Arvo, he will still try to rob you and blame you for the robbery he committed. Its determinant what happens, so its not Janes fault that Arvo sneaky little prick. You might aswell blame Clementine for their robbery attempt, because she also has dialogue options to provoke Arvo.
Dont try to use logic and reasoning, if you are ignorant about the facts.
"Treats Arvo like shit for no good reason" -- zykelator
Yeah, It's not like Arvo had just brought his gang of Russians to mug/threate… moren Kenny's group or anything. Its not like Arvo's actions had led to a blood bath... right?
It was a complete miracle that no one in the group had been killed. -- Belan
Wow that exchange was pure ownage, LMAO nice job Belan. By the way lets not forget that the whole ARVO situation was provoked by your hero Jane. So lets use your logic of Kenny is actually responsible for getting CLEM shot. ACTUALLY, HERP A DERP, IM SO SMART AND I DONT HAVE OPINIONS ONLY FACTS AND RATIONALITY AND LOGIC AND STUFF, AND I REMEMBER THAT JANE STOLE FROM ARVO EVEN AFTER CLEM SAID NOT TOO! AND SHE HELD A GUN TO HIS HEAD FOR NO GOOD REASON AND STOLE HIS GUN TOO!!! FOR NO GOOD REASON!!! SO JANE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ARVO COMING AFTER THE GROUP AND FOR LUKES DEATH AND FOR CLEM BEING SHOT!!
Woah it hurts my brain to eve… [view original content]
If you personally would lean towards giving up there, that's fine, but that doesn't mean the other side of the argument is stupid.
Never become a hostage negotiator... You would just get everyone killed because "we had to try". From all the things Kenny could have done, he did the only thing that would cause others to die 100%. After the first shot, he knew what game Carver was playing, and he was ready to play it too.
Only because Kenny took awhile to enact his plan (technically because Carver had to speak for dramatic purposes..). By the time Kenny got around to killing him, it only took 20 seconds. It really doesn't even matter though, you're ignoring the fact that Carlos's death was simply because he was standing in the wrong place at the wrong time, due to a variety of factors. You can't just tie that directly to Kenny specifically taking too long to do something. That's just silly. There are so many other "what-ifs" that are involved.
I know its bunch of ifs, but Kenny clearly decided to kill Carver the moment he shot his kneecaps. If he didnt want to be so brutal, most of the group would have been fine.
He was being stubborn about one plan of action, so that means he never showed any signs of wanting to be part of the team? What kind of reasoning is that? That just erases everything? And let's be honest, he had everyone's best interests in mind (obviously, considering he thought his idea was prudent).
Yeah, so just because he thinks he is doing whats best for the group, it justifies his arrogant behaviour?
Because Kenny never actually did anything to seriously harm them. Arvo on the other hand, clearly wished harm on the group. Arvo was the one who had been a clear enemy to the group. Kenny was never that guy. It made literally no sense at all to side with Arvo, let alone give him a gun.
Arvo was the one who was trying to deal with robbery peacefully and tried to calm down his "friends". Later Clementine shoots her sister, Kenny kills rest of his "friends" and starts beating him. Kenny knocks him unconscious with a gun (determinant) and then Kenny starts beating him hard, because Arvo had enough with Kennys abusive way to treat him. Yeah, i can totally see why Arvo was enemy of the group right from the start. Unlike Kenny, other memebers of the group seemed to still value human lives, but Kenny didnt care about anyone else than Clem and AJ.
First of all, Kenny had literally nothing to do with the death of Lee.
Its a butterfly effect. Something Kenny did long time ago caused something to happen later.
Because you know exactly how cold it was outside, right? Did you have the 7 day forecast on hand?
What should they have been wearing exactly? Parkas? They had a heated car.
The car crashed on snow, its windshield was broken, it had no more diesel... How could you think they could have used that car after that?
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... I… moret was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
You're not understanding. The only other alternative was Kenny surrendering. There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop Carver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up. It could even be argued that giving up is the riskier move, considering everyone is then left at the mercy of a mad man.
If you personally would lean towards giving up there, that's fine, but that doesn't mean the other side of the argument is stupid.
They spent more than few minutes inside after Carver was disarmed and could have been killed.
Only because Kenny took awhile to enact his plan (technically because Carver… [view original content]
Well i have already replied to this robbery thing.
Didnt rob for good reason? Rebecca was giving a birth to a baby, Luke was like shit and Kennys head was beat to shit. Yeah, she had no good reason to try rob him.
If the safety & survival of Clementine is your priority, doing everything to ensure this is the most rational thing to do. Now, either p… moreeople think its safe to be around mentally unstable violent man, which sounds completely delusional, or they just dont care about Clementines safety and survival. --zykelator
Oh by the way, last time I checked it was Janes violent instability and sticky fingers that made a group of russians hunt down the group looking for vengeance. How is angering other groups, especially a group of gun toting Russians, "increasing our own survival" and making Clementine a priority? Jane didnt listen to Clem when she said not to steal from Arvo, and she put a freaking gun to his head and stole from him for NO GOOD REASON! Jane set everything in motion which culminated in Arvo shooting Clem and stealing all the groups supplies. Yeah good job Jane.
"Treats Arvo like shit for no good reason" -- zykelator
Yeah, It's not like Arvo had just brought his gang of Russians to mug/threate… moren Kenny's group or anything. Its not like Arvo's actions had led to a blood bath... right?
It was a complete miracle that no one in the group had been killed. -- Belan
Wow that exchange was pure ownage, LMAO nice job Belan. By the way lets not forget that the whole ARVO situation was provoked by your hero Jane. So lets use your logic of Kenny is actually responsible for getting CLEM shot. ACTUALLY, HERP A DERP, IM SO SMART AND I DONT HAVE OPINIONS ONLY FACTS AND RATIONALITY AND LOGIC AND STUFF, AND I REMEMBER THAT JANE STOLE FROM ARVO EVEN AFTER CLEM SAID NOT TOO! AND SHE HELD A GUN TO HIS HEAD FOR NO GOOD REASON AND STOLE HIS GUN TOO!!! FOR NO GOOD REASON!!! SO JANE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ARVO COMING AFTER THE GROUP AND FOR LUKES DEATH AND FOR CLEM BEING SHOT!!
Woah it hurts my brain to eve… [view original content]
Well if your bringing that up, you couldn't help yourself yesterday, you violated the restraining order... I just found that comment funny, so i posted a funny picture to explain my amusement. Don't get me involved in your Jane/Kenny debates. I don't have any desire to.
Well if your bringing that up, you couldn't help yourself yesterday, you violated the restraining order... I just found that comment funny, … moreso i posted a funny picture to explain my amusement. Don't get me involved in your Jane/Kenny debates. I don't have any desire to.
Comments
Just like what Carlos said to Kenny, he acts and doesnt think of the consequences and that causes problems. You cant honestly think that what Kenny did was wise. If theres a hostage situation and they point guns at people, you dont take down one guard just because "we have to try". The fact that he was ready to let Alvin die also was just showing that he didnt learn from his first mistake.
Without this happening, Sarita wouldnt have lost hope with Kenny. She even says "i wish...i thought i could save him".
And, if they just killed Carver asap and left, Carlos and possibly Sarita could have survived walking through the herd.
He could have just shot him to the head and left, but he wanted to do it.
They split because Kenny treated their prisoner like shit all the time and he didnt show any signs of wanting to be part of the team.
"I got the car started so i say where we are going" Doesnt that sound like dictatorship? Arvo had a reason to shoot Clementine, but the fact that Kenny made Arvo seem lesser evil to group than Kenny, made it possible for Arvo to shoot Clementine. If they didnt let Arvo live, then they would have never reached the house, wouldnt have found the food, wouldnt have the car and the whole trip would have been different. The violence was pointless. Beating crippled teen 2-3 times while he doesnt resist.
I don't know why everyone acts like traveling up north is some sort of death trap. If Wellington turned out to be nothing but a myth, the group could just turn around and go back... not a big deal.
Like they said before, they will freeze to death. They had no proper clothing for winter and they didnt have any food for the baby. Not that this matters, but even if they followed Kennys plan, they would have been forced to return because Wellington is full. Kenny was ready to sacrifice everyone just because he believed there was safe haven in the north. If i had literally nothing to lose, no hope left, i would go search for Wellington, but i wouldnt force everyone to go search it with me.
He's just going to keep acting like Kenny sat and made a rational choice rather than the more obvious knee-jerk reaction Kenny had. Kenny as a character has never been one for sitting back and thinking things out.
Kenny's entire character can be summed up by one sentence:
"I don't know what the fuck you're saying, but I know it's bullshit." - Kenny
No rational person would say that something they don't understand is bullshit. If he can't understand it he can't know whether it's bullshit or not. It wasn't bullshit, but Kenny wouldn't know that.
"You're.... You know... Urban" - Kenny
Just the fact that Kenny cares about Clementine and Aj and he has lost loved ones makes all the bad things he cause ok. Double standards are strong with some Kenny fans. If Jane cares about Clementine, she is manipulative selfish bitch.
One person even claims that the story is Biblical - Kenny is Jesus and Jane is Satan.
I think Kenny is the perfect example of "the road to hell is paved with good intentions." I think he means well and he tries to do the right thing but in the process he does more harm than good.
Or it could be a plot hole.
Yeah, thats true, but some people just dont want to give up on their friendship, because they care more about Kenny than Clementine.
"We have to remember that Kenny knew absolutely nothing about Carver and his group, and he knew nothing of their intentions. Us as the player didn’t even know a lot at the time, but we at least had a general idea. In hindsight it is very easy for us to look back at Kenny’s actions and call them reckless, but we need to understand this is only because we know what the outcome of the situation is. Kenny had no idea what would happen in the case of him surrendering. Seriously, why would he just assume that Carver (someone he knows nothing about) would spare everyone’s life if he laid down his gun and gave himself up? As far as he knew, Carver could have just gunned down the entire group once he had them all at his mercy. After surrendering, there was nothing stopping Carver from killing everyone and walking away with Rebecca and the baby."
What was the alternative option to dealing with the situation? Surrendering. Upon surrendering, there would be nothing stopping Carver from killing everyone (minus Rebecca of course). Giving up potentially could have been a death sentence for everyone.
So? We don't even know what would have or would not have come out of that considering she died (or was mortally wounded) minutes later. All we know is that she was disappointed in his moral decision making.
Man, and only if Jane hadn't taken so long to shoot Troy, Carlos would have been approximately 2.2ft away from his original position of getting shot and everything could have been totally fine. Or what if everyone had covered themselves in walker guts a little faster? That could have changed everything! Right?? What if Carlos had simply walked behind Sarah instead of in front of her??? Bullet would never have hit him..
Its just silly to argue about this kind of thing. The overall situation didn't change. Carlos was simply unlucky.
Didn't show any signs of wanting to be a part of the team? That's why he put his intense grief to the side to go deliver someone else's baby, right? That's why he let go of his self pity when the group came running to him for leadership? He showed as much desire to be a part of the team as anyone else did.
And yes, he didn't treat Arvo very well. Bonnie and Mike separating from everyone else (+taking all the supplies) because of that reason is just unreasonable and absolutely scumbag-ish though. Even though Kenny was the reason why they left, their reasons for doing so were laughably terrible. That's why everyone hates them.
So one line in a moment of anger makes him some kind of dictator?
So in other words, it's Kenny's fault that Mike and Bonnie made a stupid decision?
Of course the group did reap some benefits of doing what Arvo wanted, but that doesn't change the fact that Kenny was right about the guy. Kenny didn't want to trust him. Everyone else did, even to the point that Arvo is even given a gun. Clementine ends up getting shot and nearly killed by the guy everyone was so ridiculously quick to trust. Lets also not forget the fact that Arvo played a hand in causing the death of Luke, because of selfish reasons.
Obviously that isn't true though, considering Clem, Kenny, and the baby were just fine. They had a heated vehicle, and obtained supplies from elsewhere. Of course there was a risk increase, but that doesn't mean the plan was suicidal or not doable.
You sure that Kenny was right about Wellington, I think the group was right about Wellington and wanting to go south.
These kind of posts are so annoying. If you're going to criticize, then feel free to actually take me up on my points. Its so meaningless otherwise.
If you arent completely stupid, you dont start shooting people in hostage situation, unless you can make sure that the hostages survive... It was the worst possible thing Kenny could have done there and he did it.
They spent more than few minutes inside after Carver was disarmed and could have been killed.
I was talking about the situation in the house/car. He didnt care about anyones opinion, even Clementines and he was ready to go against 4 other people because HE wanted to go search for hope in the north.
How was it stupid to go away from someone who is violent and doesnt think before doing?
Lets not forget that Kenny played a hand in causing the death of Lee, the Stranger, wife, and daughter, because of selfish reasons. Arvo robs others and Kenny robs others. Only difference is that you like Kenny and that justifies his behaviour.
Realistically, they shouldnt have survived 9 days in cold with those clothes.
Both Jane and Kenny did something wrong, there's not a good choice, YOU decide wich is the right choice and make it.
You're not understanding. The only other alternative was Kenny surrendering. There was no way he could make sure of anyone's survival no matter what he did. In the case of Kenny surrendering, nothing would then stop Carver from gunning everyone down. Therefore, there is logic in not giving up. It could even be argued that giving up is the riskier move, considering everyone is then left at the mercy of a mad man.
If you personally would lean towards giving up there, that's fine, but that doesn't mean the other side of the argument is stupid.
Only because Kenny took awhile to enact his plan (technically because Carver had to speak for dramatic purposes..). By the time Kenny got around to killing him, it only took 20 seconds. It really doesn't even matter though, you're ignoring the fact that Carlos's death was simply because he was standing in the wrong place at the wrong time, due to a variety of factors. You can't just tie that directly to Kenny specifically taking too long to do something. That's just silly. There are so many other "what-ifs" that are involved.
What if Kenny decided not to do anything in regards to Carver's fate at all? Would Carlos have lived? Who knows. It's pointless to argue either way.
He was being stubborn about one plan of action, so that means he never showed any signs of wanting to be part of the team? What kind of reasoning is that? That just erases everything? And let's be honest, he had everyone's best interests in mind (obviously, considering he thought his idea was prudent).
Because Kenny never actually did anything to seriously harm them. Arvo on the other hand, clearly wished harm on the group. Arvo was the one who had been a clear enemy to the group. Kenny was never that guy. It made literally no sense at all to side with Arvo, let alone give him a gun.
First of all, Kenny had literally nothing to do with the death of Lee.
Second of all, the Stranger situation is basically the worst comparison ever. I'm so sick of the apples-oranges comparisons.. what Arvo did was clearly very different both in circumstance and intent.
Because you know exactly how cold it was outside, right? Did you have the 7 day forecast on hand?
What should they have been wearing exactly? Parkas? They had a heated car.
My opinions on my favorite fictional characters trumps everyone elses. AGREE
Thats just your opinions based off your distorted viewpoints. Where i come from people who tell others to ditch/kill their babies and are Ok leaving babies in cars surrounded by walkers are the mentally unstable ones. Good thing that baby cried after Jane got killed otherwise she murdered that baby too. Clementine voiced serious concerns about Jane ditching her. Do you not get that people say your a joke because of your inability to realize that your own thoughts and views aren't the only valid ones? Why are u even here? I had to flag your posts where you were threatening to kill yourself on this thread and the moderators deleted them, I hoped you wouldn't come back. Your just a toxic person who has no ability to see past their own beliefs.
people who ingnore instead of refute points, and resort to name calling obviously realize they are losing the argument. By the way ive seen several hostage situations ended when the swat team does a breach entry and flashbangs and gas and kills all the hostage takers. Also at least one one i can remember where a couple swat snipers ended it when the hostage taker got too close to a window. Im not saying Kenny is a swat team, simply that your premise that real life hostage situations never invovle the police using violence is BS. I always wondered why France just surrendered to Germany in WWII. Perhaps too many people who think surrender always has the best outcome.
The problem with that is - If he surrenders people might die. If he doesn't people will die. A hostage is leverage for protection and a means to an end. A hostage taker will kill hostages to press that leverage. The logical thing to do is surrender because the odds for the hostages surviving are better. You can't seem to figure that out.
If you honestly believe that Kenny put much thought into what he was doing you haven't been paying attention.
I know that. I was just speaking specifically about zykelator though, who is a prominent Jane fan. I didn't bring up Kenny/Kenny fans, because it didn't really have anything to do with what I was addressing in my first post.(personally, Lemoncakes doesn't bother me, his "troll posts" can often be clever and are quite funny to me lol)
What you cant seem to figure out is that you think your so smart with the benefit of hindsight, when in reality, the truth is nobody knows the future. Again this just sounds like a pacifists or cowards justification for surrender. Lets put all our lives in the hands of Carver and hope hes nice. If he had been somebody else besides Carver he would have killed EVERYONE. He uses the hostages to draw out everyone then kills them since he doesnt need that leverage anymore. Your seriously trying to use probability to prove your point when your basing it off nothing but your opinion. There is no evidence that says your more likely to get less people killed if u surrender to armed hostage takers. And that is exactly why nobody actually gives in to terrorist demands unless they are stupid. And for God's sake dont say something like "uh well common sense is what im basing it on" because ill go ahead and fine you 3 real life stories of people who surrendered in hostage situations and were immediately shot dead the moment they dropped their weapon, and vice versa 3 stories of people getting out of hostage situations by attacking their captors.
By the way I could also say with just as much conviction, If he surrenders everybody WILL DIE, if he fights he may be able to distract them so that some get away, He might be able to kill them before they kill all the hostages. But if surrenders he will kill them all. You have no way of proving me wrong without hindsight. You guys wanna take wellington away from us because of hindsight? Well it applies here as well then.
The sickest things is that your trying to take the murder of Walter and blame it on Kenny when it should be solely on Carvers hands.
Wow that exchange was pure ownage, LMAO nice job Belan. By the way lets not forget that the whole ARVO situation was provoked by your hero Jane. So lets use your logic of Kenny is actually responsible for getting CLEM shot. ACTUALLY, HERP A DERP, IM SO SMART AND I DONT HAVE OPINIONS ONLY FACTS AND RATIONALITY AND LOGIC AND STUFF, AND I REMEMBER THAT JANE STOLE FROM ARVO EVEN AFTER CLEM SAID NOT TOO! AND SHE HELD A GUN TO HIS HEAD FOR NO GOOD REASON AND STOLE HIS GUN TOO!!! FOR NO GOOD REASON!!! SO JANE IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ARVO COMING AFTER THE GROUP AND FOR LUKES DEATH AND FOR CLEM BEING SHOT!!
Woah it hurts my brain to even pretend to be zykelator. But hey there u go a taste of your own medicine. Explain to me why its not Janes fault for getting a group of russians mad at us in the first place? Clem did nothing to provoke him.
He's been right about important stuff ever since Season 1 tbh, but people forget it because of his anger issues
He was the one who suspected the dairy and urged Lee to investigate,he insisted the motor inn wasn't safe for the longest time and that they should leave it ASAP before the bandits tried to take it over,he predicted Lilly would snap eventually, he said there'd be a boat in Savannah, he distrusted Vernon from the start, he said they shouldn't leave the boat unattended while they search for Clem...
Kirkman himself said taking a boat out in the water and trying to find a secluded place in the water was probably the best thing one could do in the ZA, and that was Kenny's plan...
J-Master and his plot holes
Oh by the way, last time I checked it was Janes violent instability and sticky fingers that made a group of russians hunt down the group looking for vengeance. How is angering other groups, especially a group of gun toting Russians, "increasing our own survival" and making Clementine a priority? Jane didnt listen to Clem when she said not to steal from Arvo, and she put a freaking gun to his head and stole from him for NO GOOD REASON! Jane set everything in motion which culminated in Arvo shooting Clem and stealing all the groups supplies. Yeah good job Jane.
Well, where there is smoke there is fire. At least that's what I always believed.
We've heard about Wellington so much in the game, from Christa, Carver , Matthew, Kenny... It had to be out there, for a rumor to spread like that in a world where there's hardly any communication anymore.
If we're going to work with "ifs" , Jane's stunt to prove a point was pretty reckless too in regards to the baby's safety. If he started crying and walkers were nearby...
It's not really opinion when most things Kenny's been saying since Season 1 have come true one way or the other
Your choices.
Your opinions.
Kenny has been wrong allot of times and he has been right allot of times.
I hate to say it, but the best choice was leaving BOTH Kenny and Jane! They were both right about things, but they were both really bad in a group. You saw it yourself in the last episode, neither Jane or Kenny wanted to be with the group. Even though Kenny loved/loves AJ and Clem his anger gets the best of him and he puts them in danger, he is/was reckless and has not been reliable since WAY back in episode 3 season 1 when Duck and Katjaa died. As for Jane, she only likes strong people in her group and she doesn't really care what happens to the weak ones. She likes/liked Clem, but its seems like she would leave AJ in a heartbeat to protect herself, on the other hand she does do a GREAT job surviving in the dead world only because she has/had very little feelings for others. So I don't know how anyone can think these two are good for Clem and AJ! In the end when you think about it Clems best choice was with Luke's group and that was fine until Carver showed up and then things went to hell. I really wish Luke survived he was the best person for Clem!
(sorry to say this) you are a pretty hardcore Kenny fan (not even near being one of the worst) but if you look at @Lemoncakes posts from a Jane fan perspective, you will find that he is a really annoying guy, who take huge dumps on others opinions
The point of the choices is that people pick what they prefer and who they would prefer to stay with. If people want to be with jane let them jeezuz wheezuz
It's ok, I don't take any offense. I do see how Jane fans would be annoyed by Lemoncake's posts, but it's hard for me to be, because of the way he so cleverly intertwines logic with major shit talking. Even when he says it in a way that I very much disagree with(often somewhat callous and blunt), I have to give him props for his impressive prose. That doesn't necessarily mean I condone everything he says though.(I also don't know how good of an idea it was to tag him in your post, if you don't want to be associated with him..)
as long as you see that other people can be offended, then your good in my book
Well clearly you havent played the game at all, since you dont know different outcomes.
Only reason Jane considered to steal from Arvo, was because our group was in really bad shape. And the reason she threatened Arvo, was so he wouldnt come back, knowing that they would kill him. If you decided to do as Jane proposed and steal from Arvo, he comes back and tries to rob your group and sure, you can blame Jane for that, even if her intentions were to benefit the group with medicine.
If you decide to not steal from Arvo, he will still try to rob you and blame you for the robbery he committed. Its determinant what happens, so its not Janes fault that Arvo sneaky little prick. You might aswell blame Clementine for their robbery attempt, because she also has dialogue options to provoke Arvo.
Dont try to use logic and reasoning, if you are ignorant about the facts.
Never become a hostage negotiator... You would just get everyone killed because "we had to try". From all the things Kenny could have done, he did the only thing that would cause others to die 100%. After the first shot, he knew what game Carver was playing, and he was ready to play it too.
I know its bunch of ifs, but Kenny clearly decided to kill Carver the moment he shot his kneecaps. If he didnt want to be so brutal, most of the group would have been fine.
Yeah, so just because he thinks he is doing whats best for the group, it justifies his arrogant behaviour?
Arvo was the one who was trying to deal with robbery peacefully and tried to calm down his "friends". Later Clementine shoots her sister, Kenny kills rest of his "friends" and starts beating him. Kenny knocks him unconscious with a gun (determinant) and then Kenny starts beating him hard, because Arvo had enough with Kennys abusive way to treat him. Yeah, i can totally see why Arvo was enemy of the group right from the start. Unlike Kenny, other memebers of the group seemed to still value human lives, but Kenny didnt care about anyone else than Clem and AJ.
Its a butterfly effect. Something Kenny did long time ago caused something to happen later.
What should they have been wearing exactly? Parkas? They had a heated car.
The car crashed on snow, its windshield was broken, it had no more diesel... How could you think they could have used that car after that?
Well i have already replied to this robbery thing.
Didnt rob for good reason? Rebecca was giving a birth to a baby, Luke was like shit and Kennys head was beat to shit. Yeah, she had no good reason to try rob him.
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And theres another troll. Didnt we agree to stay away from eachother? Or was it someone else?
Well if your bringing that up, you couldn't help yourself yesterday, you violated the restraining order... I just found that comment funny, so i posted a funny picture to explain my amusement. Don't get me involved in your Jane/Kenny debates. I don't have any desire to.
Wait... you are not a troll?
Well dont provoke me by calling me a troll then.